Monday, September 16, 2013

Charter of Secularism...Death Rattle of the Sovereignty Movement

In politics as in life, you never really know how events will play out, but when you embark on a foolish or ill-thought out course of action, it shouldn't be surprising when things blow up in your face.

This week, I watched a news story about a young Quebec couple who sold off everything, quit their jobs in order to set sail with their two young children on a year-long adventure, sailing the Caribbean. Asked by the interviewer if they had enough sailing experience to embark on such an adventure, the couple admitted that they didn't, but they were going to wing it just the same.

How do you think that's going to work out?

As I watched the story, I could not help but worry for the children, victims of idiot and reckless parents.

Such is the Charter of Secularism, a singularly stupid idea brought forward by an idiot and reckless government, with the very real potential of harming individual citizens and wreaking what social harmony we now enjoy.

So it isn't surprising that the wheels are falling off the bus of this latest and most desperate gambit of the sovereignty movement, the so-called Charter of Secularism.

While the rubes in Herouxville applaud the government's attempt to turn Quebec immigrants into poutine/maple syrup/bacon lovers who enjoy the music of Marie-Mai and the humor of Mike Ward, all I can say is...

T'aint gonna happen....

It remains a simple undeniable fact that if you allow for Muslim, Jewish, Sikh or Buddhist immigration, you are going to end up with Muslim, Jewish, Sikh and Buddhist citizens and forcing them to dress up as Santa Claus just won't change that fact.
This is the fantasy of the Charter of Secularism, where the old dictum of getting what you pay for is  suspended in favour of an altered perception of reality, where one hopes that the pizza ordered from Dominos, will actually taste like poutine.

At the onset, the Charter had enough popular support to make it's chances of being passed into law, while not a slam dunk, highly likely.
But of course, the devil is in the details and it hasn't taken long for reality to catch up with fantasy, the cold hard truth a sad reminder that you shouldn't go off sailing with no plan, no experience or technical know-how.

Last week we learned that the Charter of Secularism hasn't a snowball's chance in Hell of passing the most rudimentary constitutional challenge.
Clever La Presse reporter Yves Boisvert, realized that Quebec Justice Minister Bertrand St-Arnaud's strange silence meant that something was rotten in Denmark,
A little digging by the reporter turned up the fact that the PQ government was advised by its own legal department that the proposed law was undeniably unconstitutional.
And so the government sought a favorable opinion, from an outside jurist.
The best they could come up with was an opinion by Henri Brun, a constitutional lawyer who told the government that the case was pleadable, but not much else. He also told them that the chances of success would increase if the law pertained only to government employees in positions of power (police, judges, guards, etc.)

And so the government is proceeding, knowing full well it will lose in court, exactly the path chosen by Camille Laurin who included clause after clause of nonsense in the original Bill 101, full well in the knowledge that the Supreme Court would invalidate the unconstitutional parts, in a cynical, but not unsuccessful manoeuvre to enrage Quebecers against Canada.

But things are unraveling quickly, yesterday a reader (Vincent Beaudry) pointed out a story of intolerance in Quebec city where a Muslim woman was actually physically assaulted in a shopping mall, because of her veil, a perfectly predictable reaction to the targeting of non-Christians of faith. Link{fr}
I warned you that this would happen a while back, it wasn't exactly a bold prediction, the logical extension of a policy of the demonification of Muslims. What is most difficult to accept is that the PQ also understood that these types of reactions were inevitable, but proceeded anyway, willing to roll the dice in a sad attempt to breathe life into the moribund sovereignty movement.

We are now living the theatre of the absurd as highlighted by another story, one that hasn't really made the rounds because it was hidden behind a pay wall in Le Journal de Quebec. Link{fr}
As farcical as Alice in Wonderland or as stupid as the promotion of the non-religious nature of the Crucifix in the National Assembly is the story of a Christian chapel, located directly within a government building  and this for the last twenty years. It seems that public employees of faith can celebrate Mass twice a week without leaving the comfort of the building housing their government office. The chapel is provided by the government rent-free and a Catholic priest ministers to the faithful.
So when all this was revealed one would expect the government to quickly declare that in the new secular Quebec, it would no longer be acceptable to tolerate the chapel.
If you thought that, you would be wrong.
In a illogical leap of faith, the assistant to Bernard Drainville said that the issue is complex and needed to be studied further, as the chapel could be considered a reasonable accommodation and that non-Christians had equal access to the facility.
I kid you not.
I am not even going to get into arguing why this is wrong, I have too much respect for readers who can no doubt draw their own conclusion.
Now readers, do not for a moment conclude that I am advocating that the chapel be removed, I'm just pointing out the absurdity of the utterly incoherent PQ position.

Last Thursday, the head of the Bloc Quebecois kicked out Bloc MP Maria Mourani from caucus because she spoke out harshly against the Charter. It was a singularly stupid move, one that everybody on the Charter side recognized as a supremely clumsy,  self inflicted wound with the direst of consequences.
After all, if the PQ cannot convince one of the most ardent separatists from the ethnic community of the worth of the Charter, how on Earth will they convince ordinary ethnics to come along for the ride?

I've no sympathy for Madame Marouni, a useful idiot extraordinaire who has tried, mostly in vain, to get Ethnics to ignore the ethnocentric nature of the sovereignty movement .
Maria Mourani is was as militant a separatist as they come, she was a founding member of the Mouvement Montréal français and was named as Patriot of the year by none other than the Société Saint-Jean-Baptiste de Montréal.
I wonder if she will be asked to return the award like Lance Armstrong who was forced to return his Olympic medals because of doping. Surely Madame Mourani has heaped a commensurate measure of humiliation upon the movement.

Mouroni, a maronite Christian from Lebanon gave an impassioned news conference on Friday denouncing the wedge politics of the PQ and then headed off to a mini-debate with none other than Louise Beaudoin on Radio Canada.

I make mention of the debate because Madame Beaudoin gave a hilarious performance where she actually lost her composure screaming at Mouroni that in order to be included as one of the family, the hijab had to go. Beaudoin became so enraged that the moderator had to grab her arm, in order to calm her down. This surreal exchange can be seen here, the good part taking place at the 5:00 minute mark. Watch the video

It occurred to me while watching the video that people like Beaudoin and Drainville are clueless as to what makes up the beliefs of people of faith.
To them, suspending one's religious commitment for a few hours a day is a reasonable and viable solution.
For an atheist it makes perfect sense, for a person of faith it is beyond the pale.

Should the law ever come to pass whereby teachers, nurses and doctors are subject to the removal of religious head wear, (it will never happen) there will be no doubt those who comply.
But make no mistake about it, there will be thousands who won't.
For them, commitment to religious principles trumps all and there isn't a chance in heck that they will conform, regardless of the repercussions.

I give as an example the great Los Angeles Dodger pitcher, Sandy Koufax, a three time MVP  and the author of an amazing four no hitters.
In 1965, the first game of the World Series fell on Yom Kippour, the holiest day of the year for Jews.  As the star of the team Koufax was slated to pitch but declined on religious grounds, despite the fact that he he wasn't particularly religious.
But to play on Yom Kippour would send a message to the Jewish community that he wasn't prepared to do. Read a stirring account.
"The Dodgers lost that game 8-2. Future Hall-of-Famer Don Drysdale, who started in Koufax's place, gave up seven runs in the first three innings. It is rumored that when Dodger manager Walter Alston headed out to the mound to take Drysdale out of the game he said, "I know, Skip. Right now you wish I was Jewish, too."
The rest of the story is that Koufax returned to start three of the remaining six games and was named the Series MVP after pitching a shutout in the deciding Game 7." Another link
It is perhaps, beyond the ability of Beaudoin, Marois and Drainville to understand religious commitment, for many Quebecers, faith cannot be suspended, put on or taken off, as a coat.

There are thousands of Sandy Koufaxs in Quebec, people who will never comply with the anti-religious edict, damn the torpedoes.
What will happen when a teacher shows up to class with a hijab in defiance of the  law? Will she be dragged out of the class?
How about a doctor or nurse who shows up to an emergency room shift in illegal attire?  Will they be refused the right to work and will patients be deprived of medical attention?
The truth is that those with options will leave rather than knuckle under and the sad reality is that the most talented are the ones who have the most options.
Will Quebec be better off and can we really afford to lose so many of our productive citizens or will the familiar Quebec refrain of "We don't need no stinkin' doctors/nurse/teachers be struck up once again?

In all of this I am convinced that the Charter of Secularism is the death rattle of the sovereignty movement, a last ditch effort to to play the ethnocentric card, because all else has failed.

It will not work.

Sovereignty has been dead for a long time, dumping on people of faith inside the ethnic community has washed away any chance of support the movement had outside White/Catholic/Francophones.

Die hard separatists, those who are open and truly inclusive (there are many) must be saddened that the ethnocentric caricature of the separatist movement as painted by opponents has turned out to true.

Separatism is not about building a French nation comprised of different elements, it is about exclusion of any and all who will not conform to the separatist ideal.

Sad, desperate and singularly illegal and unenforceable, that is the Charter of Secularism, another PQ masterpiece of failure.


  1. Perhaps the Quebec sovereignty movement should finally be recognized as an organized religion in the Quebec Charter of Rights and Freedoms.

    We could call this religion Quebecism.

    After all, Quebecism has a congregation of several million faithful, devoted followers who believe in miracles. It has a fervent clergy that spreads the gospel and promises its believers absolute paradise - a land of milk and honey, where men, women, and children from all cultural and religious backgrounds can disavow their former misguided beliefs and find salvation and acceptance within the Quebecois congregation.

    Quebecism even has an historic symbol at its core, the Quebec flag. The congregation is strongly encouraged to exhibit the flag in public. Followers often drape the flag around their shoulders (like a hebrew prayer shawl), tattoo their bodies and paint their faces with flag icons. They march with the flag proudly waving, and sing songs about it.

    It fact, since the congregation identifies so strongly with the flag, perhaps it should be added to the list of religious symbols, (ie hijab, kippa, turban, etc) and banned from all public institutions in Quebec.

    Just a thought.

    1. Two Cents Worth, I think you're onto something. They could rename June 24 "Quebecmas".

    2. Check out Beaudoin at 3:45-4:00 and tell me that L'Etat is not a religion for these people.


    4. "Culture in the shape of nationalism was a potent displacement of god. Like the almighty, the nation was sacred, eternal, autonomous, self-creating, indivisible, without end or origin, the ground of all being, the source of personal identity, the principle of humanity, the champion of the dispossessed, transcendent of individuals, and worthy not only of their faith but of their literal self-sacrifice. The nation is honored by solemn rights and furnished with a pantheon of secular saints or patriotic heroes. By the middle of the 20th century, it even had something of the ubiquitousness of the almighty as well: nothing is more international than nationalism." - Terry Eagleton

    5. FROM ED
      Adski, In WWII and WWI soldiers fought for GOD; KING and COUNTRY in that order. Oddly enough families were never mentioned.

  2. Wrong guess, Editor. The Charter, as well as Bill 14 and maybe others have the role to rally the sovereignist vote for the next election. It is irrelevant if they pass or not now.

    That being said, the Charter really fills a need - just see Europe, Norway and Holland in particular with people being assassinated just because being outspoken against Islam. Unfortunately, the Charter is biased - some pure-laines are more equal than other animals. And it does not go far enough (e.g. it should cut subventions by the government towards faith schools).

    1. An Importation,

      Who got assassinated in the Netherlands for being outspoken against Islam?

  3. Today's polls confirm your post.
    The PQ has gone full bigot with their Charter and gained a percentage point or two of support. But in doing so they have pushed the Liberals into majority government territory.

    It's blown up in their face, and they have nobody to blame but themselves.


    1. Vraiment?

      16 septembre 2013: Sondage Léger montre un Québec complètement divisé, mais peu d'effet sur les intentions de votes

    2. The polls released today show that either the Liberals would win a one seat majority or would at least win a minority government if an election was held today.

    3. I sincerely doubt the PLQ will come up on top. The regions will push the PQ up, and Marois is banking on that. Stupid she is not.

      I'd actually go as far as saying that there is a chance PQ will get a small majority.

    4. Tout de même incroyable que les anglos/allos fassent toujours "confiance" aux libéraux,d'un autre côté,ils n'ont aucun choix...Vraiment triste de n'avoir qu'eux comme sauveurs.

  4. Spin, lies, propaganda...the Quebec way...

    If you don't know your past...Enjoy

    Now if we can just get him (them - the liberals) to revoke all the discriminatory laws in Quebec (including language legislation) we'll have accomplished something really worthwhile. I do like to dream every now and then (sarcasm).

    To all Quebecers: Stop picking on the minorities that happen to live in this province!

    1. Les Québécois représentent la véritable minorité.S'il vous plait,cessez d'inverser les rôles.

    2. No government in any other province in this great country of Canada "picks" on minorities by restraining freedoms - only in quebec is this acceptable behaviour! That's what makes quebec so "special". (Sarcasm again).

    3. Vous ne seriez pas en train d'essayer d'amalgamer les droits des immigrants à ceux des anglos par hasard?

    4. FROM ED
      I think Dr.Couillard will get the economy moving. As far as advertising goes he has said it will not change. He's right. Everyone's seems satisfied. Whatever he plans he will keep silent on until after he is elected. We'll have to be patient and see. At least we know it will be better. Ed

    5. Quebec nationalists' logic only works if they frame the debate in a very specific way, they have no overriding sense of justice or fairness, they are only concerned with furthering their language and culture, the rest be damned.

      French needs to be protected because they are a minority, but it should be spoken because they are the majority. That statement makes no sense without very specific framing.

      French needs to be protected because it is the historical language of Quebec. Yet no steps are taken to protect the native languages of Quebec that face obscurity. Again the statement only makes sense with very specific framing, in this case the framing is that history only starts in 1608.

      Religious symbols should be banned, except for the cross etc. The contrived framing is that Christianity is not a religion, it is a historical symbol.

      The real reason they push these types of things is not for the reasons they give, those are really just harebrained excuses, the real reason is they live in perpetual fear and anger of those different than themselves, and sadly believe the world is all about us versus them, and they need to win, individual freedoms be damned.

      There should be no difference between the rights of anglos or of francophones or those of immigrants or religious minorities, and by that of course I don't mean we should repress everyone as SR would lazily retort, but they should be given their rights and freedoms.

    6. "Vous ne seriez pas en train d'essayer d'amalgamer les droits des immigrants à ceux des anglos par hasard?"

      What part of Rights are Rights are RIGHTS...did we not understand?

    7. Les immigrants seraient-ils moins antipathiques que les anglos auprès des médias et des Québécois de façon générale?

      Une question comme ça.

    8. Rights are Rights Are RIGHTS !!!

      It is not about personalities...and appearing....unfriendly or is not about the is about preserving the ideal of Rights and Freedoms....if for a moment you'd get over yourself and realize it is not personal, OR ABOUT may actually understand something...for once in you Life.

    9. Plusieurs aimeraient bien savoir à quels droits vous faites allusion.

      Les anglos sont bizarres,ils se sentent opprimés alors que nous les traitons de façon tout à fait correcte.

    10. I love how according to you, We (Anglos/ Allos) r treated well...and we have nothing to complain about? Which is false by the way, I don't see metro ticket agents beating up Francophones, or throwing tomato sandwiches at French speaking citizens, so please stop trying to pass yourselves off as honorable.

      The fact remains that we are all interlinked and if the Rights and Freedoms of one individual are sabotaged it means that there are cracks in the foundation that is our Democracy. WE are ALL in danger...don't you get it? I don' t give a rats ass if you choose to respect my rights but then trample on those of my only means that if you went after his won't be long you'll come after mine. So how you treat others is EVERYONE's business.

  6. Lord Dorchester

    Raw and naked ethnic Quebecois Nationalism finally rears its ugly head. This Charter was a huge mistake for the PQ. The very public expulsion of Mourani from the BQ/PQ was a blunder of incalculable proportions. That one move alone will set the Separatist movement years in wooing the ethnic vote. This basically confirms what virtually all ethnic and visible minorities thought about the PQ in the first place, they are an ethnic nationalist party that pays lip service to visible minorities for their electoral support. Any immigrant/ethnic Separatist sympathizer will now rethink their allegiance to "the cause". How many times have you seen that infamous 1995 Parizeau speech played this past week? With this Charter fiasco, Quebec is yet again being ridiculed internationally. Marois is a shrewd operator but this was an amateur move.

  7. A naughty moose:
    Good point editor. What happens when people defy the law, fines, prison, gas chamber? Where does it end ? What if I decide to start a new religion and decide that brown shoes are a symbol of my connection to mother earth and God. Will brown shoes be out-lawed ?

  8. Souverain ou pas,il va falloir établir des règles pour les accomodements religieux,un cadre de travail.

  9. FROM ED
    One has to wonder about Pauline Marois. This poor woman must realize that her dream is living it's last hurrah and that everything she does to save it blows up in her face. It must be the way that Hitler felt during the last days in his bunker when message after message of bad news poured in. She realizes I'm sure that she has failed to win seperatism, failed as a Premier and thhe worst for her, she has lost face among those who feed her sadly needing ego. Ed

  10. On the upside support for this charter of "values" is dwindling.

    Probably because these polls were taken after what was in the charter was actually announced, unlike all the other ones conducted before the specifics were detailed. There were probably a lot of people rationalizing that the hypocritical aspects of the charter would not be in the final version, they were wrong, very wrong.

  11. JF

    Denying individual rights and freedoms? The tyranny of the majority? These clowns just rocked a hornets nest and the end result will scar them for years. Progressive Francos are four-square against this Charter. These are the people that publish their opinions DAILY in Quebec. Unlike the inbred fruit flys that live in the hinterland of Quebec that support this trash that no one will ever see or hear.

    1. All I can say is....they F..... with the wrong people !

  12. "The tyranny of the majority"

    Yes, it is. You should read Maria Stuarda (1800) by F. Schiller (Stimmenmehrheit ist kein Beweis angesichts der Wahrheit = the voice of the majority is NO proof of justice).

    Francophones are a minority in Canada (even in Montreal), French has to stay because it's a part of our heritage, BUT the PQ and its death-driven ideas must go.

    What a yo-yo Legault has turned out to be - talk about flapping in the wind. He never has the guts to say when something is wrong for the economy but pretends to care about same economy. When will these seppies learn? You can't have it both ways.

  14. Usually, these pools favor PQ. I bet Liberal will win this election.

  15. Typical Harper so far:
    Let's hope he's right and the people realize how difficult this charter would be to administer let alone the fact that it breaks the Human Rights Charter used all over the free world.

  16. Don't worry, the high quality french media will make sure to poke at the religion issue as much as possible to help the PQ maintain support for their charter:

    I still think the PQ is hoping their charter will fail, that way they will be able to point out how Quebec and the ROC have such different values, and how Canada tries to block any Quebec progress.

    1. Just heard on CTV news that they are now complaining about how the ROC is "Quebec bashing" because of all the publicity the Charter is garnering. Of course, I agree with you Quebecker - it's all to point out how Canada keeps them from becoming what they really are: a self centered bunch of racist bigots that think of no one but their own pur laine francophone community and to hell with everyone and everybody else. "Open to the world" BS that they spout all the time - "Open to the pur laine francophone Quebecois" is what it should read.

      She is basing her next planned neverendum referendum on getting more than 60% of the separatist vote based on Bill 14 and the Charter of Quebec Values but I think she may find it all bites her in the ass. Furthermore, I hope the ROC publicizes these matters even more now that the PQ are asking they back off. The more rotten publicity this gathers, the better for the federalist cause in quebec because a lot of her support is falling by the wayside with the exposure from the press. Separatists are re-thinking of exactly what kind of society they are creating with these hateful, exclusionary bills.

    2. No one ever says anything to them. They ALWAYS do as they please. Now that we dare speak, and the ROC finally makes an appearance on this whole debate, because how can anyone stand by while once again they choose to spit on Rights...are Rights are becomes Quebec bashing...

      Get A Life...Get A Jobbbbbb

  17. Charte des valeurs: Couillard veut provoquer une crise, selon Duchesne

    Pierre Duchesne soupçonne les libéraux du Québec de vouloir provoquer une crise sociale pour torpiller le projet de charte des valeurs.

    Exactement,comme ils l'ont fait dans le dossier des étudiants.

  18. Well what is good for the goose is good for the gander! Why should popo be the only one to insite provocation! I hope the Doctor has a field day.

    1. me too = bring it on and shine the light on the whole mess.

    2. De quel "mess" parlez-vous?Le canada?

  19. @editor thank you for that video of L. Beaudoin. It was greatly amusing but I must say what I found most interesting is when Mme Beaudoin, at a certain pt...openly states she is... "Canadienne Francaise" ...notice she does not refer to herself as Une québécoise ...interestingly indeed...and makes u think...

  20. Here is something interesting:

  21. Oh and this one:

    I particularly love this part:

    "The wealth of Quebec is its capacity to welcome people and to allow them to evolve in a context of sexual equality and true freedoms.

    We have our accents, our habits, our religions and our beliefs. But we are all Quebecers."

    Not according to popo and company..I'm afraid.

    1. here's a better opinion for you anectote:

  22. Many thanks Ed for this blog; one has to wonder why the PQ leadership, in a minority government position, has taken the high risk of floating first Bill 14 and now this Quebec Charter of Values which can only alienate moderate separatists and new immigrants, particularly those of a different ethnic background. For the BQ to support the PQ's Quebec Charter of Values and to toss out their most distinguished immigrant MP (a Christian) in a very pubic and ugly manner is quite unbelievable. While neither the PQ or BQ are dead, their support among middle of the road "Quebecois" can only fall, and any hope of creating a constituency of support among any immigrants or non-ethnic Quebecois, including those from French speaking countries from North and West Africa or Haiti etc. is likely to be dead for decades to come.

    Lets hope something positive comes out of the political suicide of the PQ and BQ, that the separatism movement dies, and that Quebec as a province takes its place once more as a province within Canada of opportunity open to all who live here, and stops trying to create a quasi-apartheid style two-tier society with Quebecois on the upper level with all others on the lower level.

    Lets also hope that the next bodies to implode are those public service unions who formally supported the Quebec Charter of Values - whose stated positions may not reflect the views of large numbers of their members, many who whom may not be rabid zenophibic separatists.

    1. The problem with the PQ and that they are arrogant...plain in your face ARROGANT...truth be told.....they have little to be arrogant about.

      Arrogance and impulsiveness ...lethal combination.....but hey I gotta ask...How's that work in' for ya? Lol

  23. @Editor
    As usual an excellent and very informative article. I watched the debate between Louise Beaudoin and Maria Mourani and have a couple of observations of my own.
    The current debate launched by the PQ is, and has been identified by many political commentators, a classic exercise in wedge politics designed to benefit a political movement, namely the PQ. The PQ has deftly chosen an issue that they knew would further divide Quebec along the lines of; rural versus urban, allophone/Anglophone versus Francophone, and so on. Many Quebec political commentators have also observed that this issue is also, at least for the time being, taken the public’s attention away from the PQs dismal handling of the economy and a multitude of other bread and butter issues. That said, the debate was bound to happen at one point in Quebec so it may as well happen under a PQ government because any government that tries to tackle this issue will end up bloodied!
    During the lively exchange Madame Beaudoin stated that fifty years ago French Canadians chose to become Quebecois. That statement is standard PQ nationalist propaganda. In Quebec nationalist circles prior to 1960 Francophones were poor exploited surfs working in paper mills owned by their Anglophone masters who controlled them via an unholy alliance negotiated by the clergy of New France and British General Brock soon after the battle of the Plains of Abraham. Utter friggen nonsense and a fine example of revisionist history. The Quiet Revolution didn’t just happen in Quebec. Similar movements happened in most other jurisdictions, in the US it was called the civil rights movement, in the rest of the western world, including English Canada, it is more commonly known as the rise of the welfare state. Obviously, in Quebec the movement was made slightly more colourful due to the language of the majority population but at the end of the day Quebec’s revolution was pretty standard, (and long overdue), for the time period.
    The PQ is a party that has a certain legitimacy. I may not agree that Quebec requires full independence to develop but I admit that their point of view is legitimate and worthy of debate. Unfortunately for the PQ, and fortunate for Federalists, their very legitimacy is their Achilles Heel insofar as that any crackpot can join the PQ and spout ethnocentric racist nonsense under the cover of a legitimate political movement. I can just imagine René Levesque, Gerard Godin looking down on the sad state of affairs of today`s PQ, they must be turning in their graves!

  24. Qui est derrière le Collectif Québécois contre l'Islamophobie?

  25. Charte des valeurs: davantage d'incidents et d'inquiétude

    Et ce n'est malheureusement qu'un début.

    Bravo aux autres cultures qui savent s'adapter pacifiquement à de nouveaux environnements.

  26. Perquisition de l’UPAC au siège social du PLQ à Montréal

    What a mess

  27. Dear Mr. Editor-

    Long time reader but this is the first time I have decided to comment. I appreciate this blog and the exchange of ideas that occurs right here in real time. I think you do an excellent job to police the blog to the best of your ability and keep it relevant, interesting and fair.

    However, I can not understand why S.R is able to continue to post to this blog? More times than not his comments have nothing to do with the subject? For example his latest post regarding the Liberal Party siege by UPAC. How is this post relevant to what we are discussing here which is the "Charter of No Values" proposed by Quebec? There are many more of his posts with no relevance to the topic at hand and far more egregious to the conduct of the blog which you have made clear to all of us on several occasions.

    Why not expunge this internet troll with to much time on his hand from our exchange, which for the most part is commented and followed by intelligent people of both French and English? Why coddle him and allow him a forum to disrupt the people who are here to engage in serious conversation?
    He has many options as you know where he can spew his nonsense and it would actually be welcomed by the readers.

    Thanks for hearing me

    1. Vous venez vous-même de rater l'occasion de commenter intelligemment sur le sujet du jour.
      Saviez-vous que personne sur ce blogue ne vous l'empêche?

    2. "More times than not his comments have nothing to do with the subject?"

      He's using a trick of every tenth-rate lawyer.

      "Dershowitz is intelligent enough to know that he can’t respond, so he does what any tenth-rate lawyer does when you have a rotten case: you try to change the subject, maybe by vilifying opposing counsel. That changes the subject. Now we talk about whether opposing counsel did or did not commit this iniquity. And the tactic is a very good one, because you win, even if you lose. Suppose your charges are all refuted. You’ve still won. You’ve changed the subject. The subject is no longer the real topic. And even if the charges are false, the topic’s been changed. That’s the basis of it." - Noam Chomsky on Alan Dershowitz

    3. In that case shouldn't it be the presiding court judge bringing council back with an "irrelevant as it pertains to subject at hand" or downright OverRuled??? Just askin' lol

    4. FROM ED
      Anectote, In that case, the presiding Judge you speak of would be Editor. Why put this extra on him just so you can go on conversing with S.R.As well as posting in French the links he gives are all in French so he wins both ways. How could you possibly not be smarter than S.R.. Ed

  28. FROM ED
    Might I suggest for those who insist on answering trolls, Don't answer S.R. unless he posts in English. We know he's quite capable of writing English and by answering his French you help him do whaat he wants, turn our blog French. Ed

  29. Let's face it, the root cause of this problem is the immigration policy. For too long, the government has allowed peoples with mismatched norms and values to immigrate into the country. Now they're realizing their mistake and trying to homogenize everyone. It will never work. The only thing they can do is change where they draw immigrants from. The ability to speak French cannot be the utmost important skill that qualifies immigrants. Immigrants must be drawn from countries with a similar cultural makeup, to avoid the integration problems that we are witnessing. Asking someone to learn French is easy, asking them to completely change their culture, religion, values, ethics, norms etc. is hopeless for the immigrant and the state.

  30. FROM ED
    Another problem is where they draw from. Last night I visited an old friend in the Verdun hospital. I tried to ask a question of the sole male nurse but could not understand his Haitian french. A lady visiting the other patient said to me, "I speak four languages and I know three dofferent dialects of French but I can't make out a word he says" Ed

    1. Ce n'est du français mais du créole.

    2. Haitians don't speak creole to people who don't speak creole (such as non-Haitians), sad twerp...

  31. changing demographics are changing demographics. If a political movement seeks a majority of support, it has to reach out to minorities who belong to a growing demographic that has lots of weight when it comes to the popular vote in a referendum.

    The Maria Mourani episode proves that Quebec nationalism is in fact Ethnic Nationalism. Dissent is not tolerant among the ruling political class, it's the ''my way or the highway'' approach.

    The sovereignty movement needs the ''ethnic vote'' to win. Visible minorities have increased in numbers by 70% since 1995.

    But nope, they chose the road of alienation (Marois) and condescension (Koto and Lisée).