Monday, January 9, 2012

Language Flap Damages Canadiens Brand

When we were all little kids, one of the first lessons we were taught is that we can't always get what we want.

For me, that realization came early.
I remember as a toddler seated in the grocery cart, being pushed up and down the food-laden aisles in Steinberg's grocery store and pointing to all the things on the shelf that I wanted.
My demands, punctuated by tantrums and fits of tears, were met by a steely "NO" from my mother, who remained stoically unimpressed by my animated exhortations.
She didn't even explain why not. It was just the way it was.

As we grow older and mature, we learn that there will always be things that we want, which we cannot have, obstacles and circumstances that we cannot overcome or change, and that we must accept these things as they are, or else be doomed to grow up bitter, frustrated and unfulfilled.

As they say in Alcoholics Anonymous,
...Grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change...

There are unfortunately, too many language militants in Quebec who never understood this principle and have never come to accept the world-wide dominance of English, resulting in growing up, a frustrated and bitter bunch, doomed to see their dreams of glory, dashed over and over and over again.

And so they never accept the fact that there is nothing they can do to change the enduring fact that English dominates and that Quebec will never be immune from that effect.  Never.

French language supremacists, continue to believe in a fantasy where everything and everybody cross an imaginary language curtain at the Quebec border, where all is magically transformed from English into French and from French to English upon leaving.

It is a childlike fantasy, as underscored by journalist Jean-François Lisée, who told a television audience recently that a Quebec based company, operating a powerful international conglomerate which uses English as the common corporate language around the world, can successfully manage its empire operating its head-office in French.

It's wishful thinking that plays to the innocent and naive, an unreality where French language militants believe that others will act not in their own selfish interests, but rather for the betterment of Quebec and the preservation and promotion of the French language.

They naively believe that legislation can cure the language defect, as if a law ordaining that summer be extended by three months can actually have an effect, based solely on the force of legislative will.

When faced with the cruel reality that such is not the case,  there is nothing left but bitterness and rancour.

So let me pop another bubble.
Not even sovereignty can turn an English NHL team into a French or even bilingual NHL team, it just isn't in the cards.
If the Nordiques return to Quebec City and hire a French general manger and coach, the team will still operate in English, on the ice and in the dressing room, the use of French, an illusory veneer.

The other reality that sports writers and fans fail to understand or accept, is that hockey players have no interest in learning French whatsoever and few or none who come to play for the Canadiens will ever bother with anything more than a 'Merci-Bonjour.'
For most of these players, not from the highly educated class, its a struggle to learn English, but do so because it is critical to their success.

The idea that players toiling for the Canadiens will learn a third language, a language that they will almost never use, is nothing more than a fanciful pipe dream.

Rejean Tremblay the insufferable Francophone sportswriter, who brings language into practically  every sports column he writes, is the poster boy of the indignant whiners, unable to understand or accept that for hockey players, learning French or becoming part of the French community is a non-starter.

Mr. Tremblay has in the past castigated Saku Koivu for having the audacity to remain captain of the beloved Habs for ten years without learning French as well as berating Andre Markov for his lack of French, on the occasion of him earning Canadian citizenship.

Each time I pass the Saku Koivu Cancer Centre in the Montreal General  Hospital, I am reminded that the blowhard Tremblay has branded Koivu disrespectful and an enemy of the Quebec people.

So why the ferocious reaction by French language militants to an English coach or two unilingual bosses at the Caisse de dépôt or one English boss at the National Bank?
The reaction seems a little disproportionate.
Why so much rage and bluster?

It is in fact, a bigger, much bigger deal than we Anglos can fathom.

The existence of these unilinguals in Quebec puts paid to the myth pedalled by language supremacists that Quebecers need not learn English because the language curtain surrounding Quebec is inviolable.

It breaks the promise that everything entering Quebec will be translated and that every artist, athlete, boss or politician who sets foot in Quebec will learn and use French to communicate with employees, fans, friends and colleagues.

It  makes mockery of the theory that Quebecers need not learn a second language because hockey players will learn a third.
And most importantly, it destroys the French language supremacy movement's most hallowed tenet, that Quebec can exist without English.

It is a big deal...a very big deal.

It is why little language issues are blown out of proportion.

Like in North Korea, Quebecers are indoctrinated with a fantastical bill of goods. They are told that English is irrelevant and unnecessary, while the rest of the world believes the opposite.
Like in North Korea, any real or perceived breech of this fantasy is met by a ferocious reaction by language protectors, doing their darnedest to hide the truth by obliterating reality.

And so Quebec has it's very own twenty-first version of the Bamboo or Iron Curtain, where language militants carefully attempt to stage society in their own Utopian image, to hide the reality of the outside world.

Zealots like Mario Beaulieu and Jean-François Lisée continue to discourage Quebecers from learning English by promising that they need not do so because the world will speak French to Quebec.
In this context, it is easy to understand the exaggerated reaction to English names on stores, English signs and yes, even English Quebecers, themselves.
Our very presence is a disturbance.

As long as we Anglos and Ethnics exist in Montreal, living our lives in English or bilingually, Quebecers are exposed to an alternate view of the universe, something French language militants cannot abide by.
The venomous attacks on bilingualism, remain a required element, if the myth of Quebec as a French-only society is to be preserved.
Let us remember, it is not only we Anglos and Ethnics who are targeted, but those francophones who refuse to drink the Cool-Aid and pursue bilingualism on there own. In the eyes of language supremacists, they are the the ultimate betrayers.

But there are devastating consequences to this manic pursuit of a non-existent French Shangrila.

Failure to accept the linguistic reality of the world, is a cancerous tumor on Quebec society, sapping the province of its strength and vitality.

The rally on Saturday night in front of the Bell Centre by about 150 French language militants was just another desperate attempt to alter realty.
Beaulieu framed by "Down with Molson the Traitor" sign

RACISTS MESSAGES OF HATE
The mantra of the militant leaders that their movement is not about the hatred of English, but rather about the promotion of French, is a lie that signs like these ones attest to.
What if Albertans had a demonstration and wore T-Shirts saying that there were too many Francophones in the federal government?
I'm sure Mr, Beaulieu and company would be screaming 'Francophobia' at the top of their lungs!

So what can we expect as a result of this demonstration and the messages of hate towards English in the Montreal Canadiens organization?

Loudly demanding that the Montreal Canadiens tilt towards French, has no other effect but to thin the ranks of those willing to try a career in Montreal, especially those elusive free agents who are presented with 29 less bothersome destinations to choose from.
 "Mr. Molson-There's too many Anglos on your Boat"
(By the way, this realty of talented people refusing to come to Quebec over language is repeated in industry after industry)

And so the Montreal Canadiens brand will forever be diminished by the language brouhaha surrounding Randy Cunneyworth's unilingualism.
When he is ultimately sacrificed on the language altar, it will serve as a cautionary lesson to the entire NHL community.

Skip Montreal, it is a hateful place where English people who don't speak French are unwelcome.

If nice guys like Cunneyworth, Koivu and Markov are to be vilified ...well count me out.

Call it the 'Lindros Effect' or whatever.
Agents of star players will cross off Montreal from the list of acceptable destinations and so the Canadiens will choose from has-beens, also-rans and aging veterans closing out their career. Its already happened, but no one will admit it.
"Montreal Is Under English Occupation"
This coupled with the strange fact that francophone stars eschew Montreal as well, ensures that the team is on a downward spiral, sucked into a linguistic black hole, never to escape.

There is a price to pay for the foolish preoccupation of battling a language enemy that cannot be defeated.
Quebecers to this day have never realized what this preoccupation has cost them, shielded by successive governments which immunized them from the consequences through deficit spending and indulgent transfer payments from English Canada.

Quebec is on its way to a rendezvous with destiny.

When the province hits its fast approaching debt ceiling and the Rest of Canada decides to no longer support the current equalization program, it will be time to face the music.

Sadly, that swan song will be English.

***************************************************************

POSTCRIPT;
Having just completed the last episode of HBO's stunning hockey documentary, 24/7-Road to the Winter Classic, I am struck by the level of skill, toughness and dedication that professional hockey demands from every single one of its participants, on every single level.

Unsuitable for the Canadiens?
Thinking back to the nonsense published by Quebec language supremacists that somehow francophones are discriminated against in the NHL and that teams deliberately play or draft lesser-talented non-Francophone players is so ridiculous that it remains nothing less than a sad fantasy woven by the self-deluded, tilting at windmills.

Imagine Flyers general manager Paul Holgren telling coach Peter Laviolette that a certain talented French player won't be playing in the Winter Classic because it's important that the English language be preserved as the dominant force in the NHL.
I daresay that the Flyers would have played a unilingual-Swahili-speaking-Black-half-Jewish/Muslim-dwarf, if they thought it could help them beat the Rangers. 

Watching the virtuosic performances of both Peter Laviolette and John Tortorella behind the bench and in the dressing room, was nothing short of enthralling.
It was to say the least, an exceptional experience, one that made me feel as if I was spying secretly through a keyhole, a rare opportunity to observe two maestros at work in their natural element, akin to a National Geographic special observing wild animals in their natural habitat.

Masterfully combining toughness, sympathy with single-mindedness, both these gentlemen showed viewers what a top-notch NHL coach is made of.
It's hard to comprehend that should either of these men become available to coach the Canadiens, he would be automatically rejected over language. Bah!!!

One last thought...
Both Laviolette and Torts were pretty consistent, carrying the passion and animation displayed inside the dressing room out to behind the bench. What you saw inside you saw on the outside.

It got me thinking about that the deadpan expressionless, demeanour of the recently fired coach of the Canadiens, Jacques Martin.
If what we saw behind the bench, that aloof, dispassionate and unemotional attitude, carried into the Habs dressing room, well.....it was high time he was fired.

It takes a hell of a lot of talent to be an elite NHL coach and when French language supremacists tell us that they are a dime a dozen, I'll just beg to differ.

At any rate, it's like saying that rejecting a Placido Domingo, Yehudi Menuhin, Stephen Hawking or Lady GaGa over their lack of French is just fine, because there are plenty of capable Quebec francophones that can replace them.

Sorry....t'aint so!

Read:
Read:
Heaven Help the Montreal Canadiens!

116 comments:

  1. Mr. Sauga (OK, Monsieur Sauga)Monday, January 9, 2012 at 1:49:00 AM EST

    Y'know Editor, the U.S. Civil War ended almost 150 years ago, and there is still the Ku Klux Klan (KKK), a composite organization of small minds and losers who are supremecist W.A.S.P.s that are still living in the 19th Century whilst we crossed into the 3rd Millennium just over a decade ago. They're mostly from the Southeastern U.S.

    In Quebec, we have another composite of half wits and small minds that I think I will now refer to as the QQQ, i.e., the Queue Quluxe Qulanne. Heaven knows there was only a gross people (and boy, are they gross) or so making total asses of themselves. 144-or-so pea soups for brains! What did they do, pour a can of 'abitant's vomitous-looking yellow pea soup into their craniums?

    You're quite right, Editor. These are bitter people who need a scapegoat. They will drink bitter water to their dying days, i.e., they are totally WASTING their lives; besides, the Montreal Canadiens will never be 100% French and they haven't been in their going on 103 year history; in fact, they have been under French ownership only 36 of those years.

    You may be absolutely right, Editor. For many years now the Habs have had a very hard time signing the better free agents. Daniel Brière, as stated a few days ago, overlooked the Habs despite the generous offer and went to Philadelphia instead after his Sabres contract ended. Jaromir Jagr did consider the Habs, but settled with the Flyers as well. In spite of the brouhaha here over the last month, I'm sure he's glad he overlooked Montreal.

    Let's face it: The French language media is a major, major antagonist and the number of impact players EVER coming to Montreal will be few and far between. Jeff Halpern had a pretty good year in Montreal--gone! Where the language nightmares end, the taxes begin. Even that Rick Heinz book published in 1988 by the former NHL goalie who had a lacklustre 49-game NHL career wrote about three separate North American territories: Canada, The U.S., and Quebec.

    Oh, yes, and even if the Nordiques come back to Quebec with their fleur-de-lys and Quebec flag-coloured jerseys, like the past team and its 23-year history, will operate primarily in English, from on the ice, to the bench, to the dressing room, the press conferences (unless they stipulate only Quebec-born or other French speakers can coach) to addressing the Office of the Commissioner. In any case, there will probably be more Eric Lindros fiascos, esp. in light of recent events.

    I used to like razzing Leaf fans how the Habs will win another Cup before the Leafs will, but now I'm not so sure. The Habs were spoiled with two superior GMs in the names of Frank Selke Sr. and Sam Pollock, and successful coaches like Dick Irvin Sr., but even more like Toe Blake and Scotty Bowman (HEY-THEY WEREN'T FRENCH)! Then again, Bowman did speak French. Did Blake? I don't think so! Did Pollock? NO! Did Selke? NO! The only decent Francophone GM the Habs EVER had, was Serge Savard, and he was an entrepreneur while playing the blue line along with the likes of Guy Lapoint and Larry Robinson. The Habs even went sour under him, and put in place were flops like André Savard, Réjean Houle, and yes, the fluently bilingual Bob Gainey. The line ended with Pollack. Serge Savard was one last fling, and he wasn't unhappy to be fired as GM when he was. It game him more time to spend with his other enterprises. He more-or-less dabbled in being the Habs GM, but was better at it than the clowns who followed him working at it full-time.

    I'm hoping that somehow the Habs blossom out of this language and front office manure, but it will take time until they can get rid of that $8 million albatross, Scott Gomez, and others like him. Why they resigned the injury-prone Andrei Markov is a mystery to me!

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  2. Les Québécois would be wise to strike down the bloodline requirement of Bill 101 that bans them from attending or sending their children to English bilingual schools. By not knowing how to communicate in English they really limit their career  options and WILL get passed over for any job promotions. 
     A quick anecdote, I flew down to Houston Texas last week out of Dorval for a short trip and while we were puttzing around waiting for our bags at the carrousel a Haitian-Quebecois lady that was on my flight was having a hard time and quipped to us (en francais) that she was surprised that no one at the airport in Houston spoke French, she didn't know how to speak English! Another fine product of the Quebec french public school system no doubt.

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  3. Those placards in the photos from the rally are racist and indefensible. Nothing else to say.

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  4. Ce n'est pas croyable comment j'ai honte d'être Québécoise quand je vois des choses comme ça. En fait, ce n'est pas compliqué: je ne me sens pas Québécoise du tout.

    If I'm French but am all for bilinguism, what that makes me? Oh. A traitor, yes. So I guess my position is even worse than being an anglo since I'm all against the zealots' way of thinking.

    They demonstrate for such shallow things as an English-coach and a beer company that's been funded in Montreal QUEBEC (but by an anglophone, dear Lord... What a shame!). But when it's time to demonstrate for real things, they stay at home.

    Comme dirait les CowBoys Fringants: Si c'est ça le Québec moderne, je mets mon drapeau en berne.

    Sérieusement, les Québécois qui pensent comme moi se sentent vraiment à part. Nous sommes exclus des groupes anglophones parce qu'on est des Frenchies (c'est malheureusement vrai) et on est exclus des groupes québécois-pure-laine parce qu'on ne défend pas la langue française coûte que coûte. Unfortunately, because we were born French-Canadians we'll always be linked to those zealots even if we have nothing to do with them.

    (I'm writing in both language juste parce que ça me tente. Sue me, frogs)

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  5. Maybe they just want the Nordiques back... let them have their dream and watch it end like the original Nordiques, leaving Quebec without an NHL franchise: if that doesn't cause an uprising, nothing ever will...

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  6. Gen...

    I have great sympathy for your position... Like you I was raised in both languages... Having said that things will not change unless the so called French Canadian establishment speaks out against these zealots... Stops funding them... so and so forth.. Otherwise French Canadians who disagree are complicit for doing nothing..

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  7. Hors propos mais...

    Je suis en amour avec Jodie...Quel classe pour une américaine,aucun accent.Impeccable.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wnuvQphnv9c

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  8. @9:42

    Too bad the majority of Pur laine quebecois can't speak that kind of French. Case in point the French Government doesn't allow translation of English films to be done in Quebec.

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  9. Ecxellente réponse aux journalistes sportifs:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=Y_dIBpQuXLI

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  10. I saw this you tube video in regard to the anti habs protest. I laughed my head off.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OMynKQL-7XM&list=UUMRB9x19dImJwWOVKV4yiaw&index=1&feature=plcp

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  11. @ anon 10:13

    Bonne réaction d'un lecteur:

    "Facile de faire un montage avec trois ou quatre entrevues un peu tout croches et de faire passer la majorité des manifestants pour des épais. Un peu comme le fait Guy Nantel dans la rue, ou René Dufort à Infoman, en choisissant des questions débiles et en manipulant le montage, pour amuser la Galerie sur You Tube. La Clique, en bon colonisé, a mordu à l’hameçon de ses maîtres, la famille Molson. On le sait (la Clique du plateau) que tu haïs le français…
    Abdul Butt a beau faire son p’tit comique devant la caméra, il a manqué de courage en n’allant pas interviewer plusieurs des manifestants organisateurs de Montréal français comme l’écrivain Yves Beauchemin, le prof Gilbert Paquette ou le porte-parole Mario Beaulieu, parce qu’il sait qu’avec eux, notre ami Abdul aurait été incapable de faire une entrevue avec son français douteux. Un peu comme le français écrit de la Clique ! Tout croche."

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  12. Charest en faveur d'un entraineur francophone pour les Nordiques.

    http://tinyurl.com/76gpsa8

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  13. As a former Montrealer living in New York I'm forced to watch my beloved Habs' hockey via the Center Ice package (TV channels that provide all hockey games for an additional cost). This package occasional provides the home and away broadcast, but never provides the French broadcast (why would they?). So, often I watch TSN feeds, but mostly I listen to the apposing team's homee commentators for lack of choice.

    I have found it extremely interesting that every broadcast discuss the Cunnyworth saga, always painting Quebec and the language racists in bad light .

    I will attempt to get a couple of these discussions off youtube for our consumption.

    What makes me laugh is when Quebecois think everyone in the world knows about their "plight" and sides with them, while in reality nobody knows where Quebec is and the only time they make news, it is about something bad like asbestos or language racists. Remember French Canadians, Canada wins gold medals and has peace keepers when heard on the international stage. But language crap always gets labeled as a French Canada issue.

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  14. "Canada wins gold medals and has peace keepers when heard on the international stage."

    Omar Khadr,Kyoto,etc...Oups!

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  15. "Charest en faveur d'un entraineur francophone pour les Nordiques."

    There is only one problem with this: Quebec Nordiques exist only in his and Labeaume's imagination.



    "I saw this you tube video in regard to the anti habs protest. I laughed my head off."

    Best line at 3:40, talking to a man in a hard hat:

    "Bonjour monsieur, est-ce que vous travaillez dans les mines? Apres ca, est-ce que tu vas aller dans le milieu du fleuve pour avertir les bateux quand ils s'en viennent au Port Montreal?"

    LOL

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  16. Gen: "Sérieusement, les Québécois qui pensent comme moi se sentent vraiment à part. Nous sommes exclus des groupes anglophones parce qu'on est des Frenchies (c'est malheureusement vrai) et on est exclus des groupes québécois-pure-laine parce qu'on ne défend pas la langue française coûte que coûte"

    I don't know if you're excluded as Frenchies by the Anglos, since I don't really know too many Anglophones, but I do understand that the French-English animosity has historical roots and probably cuts both ways. However, amongst the Allophones, I can tell you that reasonable Francos (like you) would not be excluded and dismissed as such.

    Anon 8:52AM has a point though. Your reputation does get smudged by your elites (media, politicians, artists, writers) who do not denounce the zealots, and do just the opposite - they give them tacit or not-so-tacit support. These elites in effect soil your reputation and ruin it for all the francophones.

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  17. Editor, vous vous surpassez.

    "Face it, frogs, English dominates.

    Accept domination. You are delusional if you refuse it.

    Surrender."

    Il ne manquait que le "you lost in 1759, get over it".

    Pourtant, vous êtes les premiers à refuser que la majorité francophone du Québec vous domine. Comment alors en arrivez-vous donc à défendre la fatalité de l'état de fait contraire ?

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  18. @anon 10:20

    Abdul butts' french was alot better then those he interviewed. I never ever heard of those so called "famous writers".

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    Replies
    1. Famous in Quebec. In other words, not famous at all.

      Delete
  19. Damien, are you saying that being opposed to Franco domination means supporting the domination of the Francos? In other words, only two states are possible - either the Francos will dominate, or they will be dominated? What about a middle ground? I, for one, would hate to see the Francos dominated, and dominating.

    As for the "You lost in 1759, get over it" statement, I see it in a different light than you. In my view, this means "stop trying to be more than you are". Or as the great American theologian Reinhold Niebuhr once said (and Editor quoted him today): "God, grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change"

    You can't change the fact that French is about as significant on the continent as any other non-English language and no amount of legislation or screaming into the sky will change this reality. But that doesn't mean that French can't survive, thrive, and be liked and respected. There is a middle ground in this somewhere. I'm sure of that.

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  20. Be smart Molson, sell the team and get the hell out of the racist province once and for all.

    Screw the team, the anti- English language Nazis (all government, politicians) and especially the racist, bigoted metis-french Kebecers. Boycott the province and anything to with it…

    Eric Lindros for Prime Minister, my hero.

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  21. La minorité anglo de Montréal est une race à part.Ils ne sont ni Québécois ni canadiens.

    Quelle étrange race.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. La minorité separatiste du Quebec est une race à part. Ils ne sont ni Québécois ni canadiens.

      Quelle étrange race.

      Delete
  22. http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=j59BiLwdNO8#!

    Future Quebec?

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  23. Future Quebec?

    Possible.J'ai remarqué que beaucoup d'anglos se font raser les cheveux.Coincidence?

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  24. "La minorité anglo de Montréal est une race à part. Ils ne sont ni Québécois ni canadiens.

    Quelle étrange race."

    Glad to hear that there are others out there who, being neither Franco or Canadian, find themselves without a cultural identity to call their own. There was a time when Canada (led by Quebec) saw this kind of ambiguity as a strength and symbolic of our enlightened society.

    Maybe next time we hold a rally for linguistic peace, tolerance, and respect?

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  25. @Anonymous 1:49PM

    It's even worse when you are French but don't belong to the zealots. You are not called something that actually has SOME KIND of cultural identity. You are just called a traitor.

    You are being rejected or you, yourself, stay away of those people but it ain't easy as people look down at you all the time.

    I'm all for the linguistic peace, tolerance and respect rally! Unfortunately, that won't change a thing.

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    Replies
    1. J'aurais honte à votre place Gen (vous avez même anglicisé votre prénom).Quelle petitesse.

      Delete
    2. And what about yourself. Always posting under anonymous to insult people personally. Petty.

      Delete
  26. "La minorité anglo de Montréal est une race à part.Ils ne sont ni Québécois ni canadiens.

    Quelle étrange race"

    Possibly, the estranged race to which you are refering,gave you a reason to be, and will likely be the future of this province... it's just a matter of time before it happens!

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  27. «La minorité anglo de Montréal est une race à part.Ils ne sont ni Québécois ni canadiens.»

    Sans compter que les Anglo-canadiens des autres provinces sont des demi-américains. Quelle étrange race.

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  28. "it's just a matter of time before it happens"

    La fin du monde et l'arrivée de extra-terrestres aussi.

    ReplyDelete
  29. "Quelle étrange race"

    Ils seraient,en quelque sorte,des itinérants culturels?

    ReplyDelete
  30. Nothing beats getting on the NoDogs blog, seeing 29 comments, and going to the comments only to find a bunch of nonsensical one liners from the resident troll.

    Thanks a lot, troll.

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  31. When the boat sinks, people start screaming... the same thing here: as this kind of separatist attitude is seen less and less and the fact that french is loosing ground in Montreal , we will see more and more 100 people rallies against everything that threatens le pays Quebec... ( btw, never gonna happen )

    unfortunately for them, once the boat is sinking ( see youtube link below ) there will not be a Bruce Willis to save them ...so start swimming guys 'coz you're on an ocean of english. And since Quebec cannot teleport near France ... well...good luck.

    It been over 40 years since this charade is ongoing and you did not manage to exterminate us ...

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VSdxqIBfEAw

    LANGUAGE FOR LIFE !

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  32. "When the boat sinks, people start screaming..."

    Rally anti bill 101?Hmmmm...FAIL!

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  33. "Rally anti bill 101?Hmmmm...FAIL! "

    Once or twice a year VS every day whining...
    Anyway, it's easy to see the "quality" of protesters at these rallies...

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  34. "quality"

    Le vieillard barbu avec son chapeau de cowboy et sa canne ou le fru à lunettes qui s'est fait éjecter de la caisse de dépôt?

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  35. To Editor,

    Agree with alot of what you said. It really does a diservice to francophones if people make francophones think that Quebec can continue to have a viable economy (which it really doesn't even have now) if it is not accepted that there are jobs that have to be in English, because of globalization.

    If Bombardier has workers that work in English, it is better for Quebec, because then there can be francophones that work there as well. If not, Bombardier will cease to exist in Quebec and there will not be a company that replaces them. Are we just going to be an economy of depanneurs?

    Everything works better when all-phones work together (anglo, franco, allo).

    To Gen,

    You are not a traitor. People who are against you are small-minded. . It's not like we're living in North Korea here. You will have more advantages in life being bilingual and will be better able to discover the world. We live in North America, so it's good to know French in Quebec but if anyone ever plans on travelling to Toronto or New York or Boston or anywhere in NA, you really have to be able to speak English. As well, there are some industries where you just have to work in English.


    To LordDorchester,

    Really? She expected to be served in Houston in French? Fact is stranger than fiction, lol.


    To Anonymous (the one that is the separatist troll)

    You make me laugh. Thank you.

    ReplyDelete
  36. @ Gen 8:32 AM

    Des insultes du genre "frogs" j'en ai lu souvent sur divers sites mais jamais venant de quelqu'un qui est visée elle-même par cette insulte.
    Il y a quelquechose de très triste là-dedans... d'en être rendue à utiliser une insulte de racistes envers son propre peuple* parce qu'on se sent aliénée.

    *Si tu n'es pas Québécoise, tu es quoi? C'est pas un choix. On dirait que toutes les autres ethnies sont fières et pourtant ça ne veut pas dire qu'ils n'ont pas honte de certaines actions de leurs compatriotes parfois. Il y a une certaine haine de soi chez certains Québécois et c'est très malsain :(

    Moi je suis fier d'être Québécois et pourtant je peut comprendre ce que tu ressens puisque j'ai vécu une période un peu semblable à la tienne (sans les insultes) mais aujourd'hui je suis bien dans ma peau et j'ai réalisé qu'on est jamais mieux accepté ailleurs que chez soi.

    ReplyDelete
  37. @Anonymous 6:37

    Hey dude, go sing to another table ... your kind is dying ...

    ReplyDelete
  38. To Anonymous 6:37PM

    In case you can't read French, she wrote "j'ai honte d'être Québécoise quand je vois des choses comme ça" in regards to people protesting against English people in Quebec.

    So, it's only when she sees injustice, that she feels that way. I think it's admirable that she would say that. It has nothing to do with self-hating. Nice try on twisting people's words.

    Me too, I am a proud Quebecois, a proud anglophone, and a proud Canadian.

    P.S. Be proud to be Canadian too. "C'est pas un choix" as you would say.

    ReplyDelete
  39. @ 7:31 PM

    Si tu as lu mon commentaire j'imagine que tu comprends le français: je ne sais pas si tu par "kind" tu veux dire les séparatistes ou tous les Québécois francophones mais moi j'ai dit fier d'être Québécois sans même parler d'indépendance. L'appui à l'indépendance varie mais nous demeuront bien vivants, le recensement de 2006 a démontré qu'il y a plus de gens parlant français à la maison que jamais au QC, plus qu'en 2001 et 1996 avant ça. Évidemment, avec l'augmentation des allophones ça change le pourcentage des francophones mais en nombres, le français ne diminue pas contrairement à dans le reste du Canada. C'est absurde cette association du français avec seulement les indépendantistes, comme des commentaires haineux au Canada anglais que la quasi-disparition du Bloc voulait dire que le Québec allait devenir anglophone et que les gens pour la défense du français ont perdu. Vraiment n'importe quoi. Même si il n'y a jamais d'indépendance, le Québec (qui n'est pas limité à Montréal, la majorité de la population habitant les régions) va continuer à parler français comme il l'a fait pendant des siècles avant d'avoir un mouvement séparatiste pour des raisons évidentes, d'abord la quasi absence d'anglophones sur la majorité du territoire habité donc assimilation impossible et tout indique que ce n'est pas le désir des francophones incluant les fédéralistes de perdre leur langue.

    @ Roger Rabbit 7:34 PM

    "nothing to do with self-hating"
    Elle a dit "sue me, frogs"...
    J'imagine mal un juif dire "sue me, kikes"...
    Si c'est une blague elle est pas vraiment drôle. Sa dernière phrase je l'ai pas vu venir et elle m'a déçue :(
    En passant, c'est dur de se dire fier d'être Canadien quand on est constamment rejetés par la majorité du pays dont certains se disent les "real Canadians" alors on se sent exclus...

    ReplyDelete
  40. Oups
    si tu par "kind" tu
    *si par "kind" tu
    Nous demeurons, pas demeuront.
    Désolé, j'aurais dû me relire avant de poster.

    ReplyDelete
  41. ...to Gen:

    Sounds like you and one or two others contributing to this blog have some kind of identity dilemma.

    Trouble is, no Francophones protest overtly takes place. Premier John James "Goldilocks" Charest is acting ever increasingly as bold as a péquiste by tightening the screws against access to English shcools, hiring more langauge police and having them harrass small business people for the pettiest uses of English. It's déjà vu all over again, as famous baseball great Yogi Berra once coined.

    If you and those of your ilk sit silently with your thumbs up your rectum, you're guilty by association. I'm quoting Reed Scowen again, just as I have many, many times in the past, by stating that these manifestations are taking place because those of the French speaking majority want it that way.

    Lookit, pal, the Germans, Austrians, French, Poles and most other Central and Eastern Europeans sat silent and looked the other way while Jews and other undesirables of the Nazis were being abducted and sent off for extermination. By sitting there and letting the government do what it's doing makes you no less guilty that them. All that's missing in Quebec are the extermination camps.

    Yeah, you're damn right you're guilty for just sitting on your thumbs and letting the Quebec government do what it's doing! Guilty, as charged!

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  42. 350 000 000 de Juifs craingnent 6 000 000 de nazis?Vous êtes courageux Mississausage guy.

    ReplyDelete
  43. To Anonymous 8:07

    Quand j'ai vu "frogs", moi, je pense que elle la dit ca concernants les francophones qui n'aime pas "les autres" et qui sont contres les francophones qui utilsent deux langues. Je comprend que vous n'aimez pas ce mot.

    En ce qui concerne le reste de pays, je pense qu'il accepte les personnes qui sont federaliste au Quebec mais pas les separatistes. Et apres parler de separation depuis 35 ans, il y a certain personne qui ont endurci leur positions...mais je pense qu'il y a plus des personne raisonables.

    Anyways, I tried to write a bit in French. I know I made lots of errors.


    To Mr. Sauga

    I don't think you can ever blame francophones for not standing up for anglophones when anglophones don't even stand up for themselves.

    Alot of people have problems getting health services in Quebec in English and there are no strong groups for anglophones to turn to anymore.

    Reed Scowen and Galganov and all of them are gone now, there is no Alliance Quebec, and the anglophones left often hope appeasement works.

    I still believe that there are more francophones that are conciliatory but they are drowned out by the media networks.

    More francophones would vote against separation today than would vote for it and the Habs still attract 21 273 no matter what the media says.

    So, while there is doom and gloom, there is also hope.

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  44. @Gen:
    Entièrement d’accord avec toi. Moi aussi j’en ai assez de ceux qui sont tellement insécurisés qu’ils se déchirent les chemises et à hurler toujours plus haut et fort… tout pour s’affirmer comme étant plus Québécois que moi. Ça me fait de la peine, mais ça me fait encore plus honte aussi.

    Le comportement engendré par cette insécurité me parait tellement ridicule et désolante qu’il m’arrive de penser qu’on a droit à un raisonnement par l’absurde presque quotidiens par manque d’autre forme de réel divertissement ou par faute d’enjeux réels.

    Nos extrémistes francophones maison partagent ainsi un manque complet de la notion d’égalité. Plutôt que de permettre à tous les Québécois de capitaliser à la fois sur les gains à réaliser à partager autant des référents culturels anglophones et francophones, on cherche à nous tenir jalousement et aveuglément rangés d’un seul côté. C’est triste, d’autant plus que beaucoup de francophones comme moi ne partagent pas la notion d’un Québec à la Parizeau ni même à la Bourassa.

    Le nationalisme pour moi est une théorie échue et révolue. Et quoique je suis parfois diamétralement opposé aux propos de Mr. Sauga, je crois qu’il a raison lorsqu’il nous reproche (francophones surtout) à l’endroit de notre passivité au dossier. C’est effectivement nous francophones, pro-bilingues et fédéralistes qui ne nous affirmons pas, autant du côté linguistique que politique, que le statu quo (et la couverture médiatique) semble toujours pencher du côté de nos amis « souverainistes ».

    Il faut que nous fassions comprendre aux anglos fédéralistes que oui nous existons en beaucoup plus grand nombre qu’on pourrait croire, et que l’on ne se fera pas malmener par un préjudice généralisé à notre endroit. Il faut aussi faire comprendre à nos propres compatriotes francophones que lorsqu’on se bat contre un ennemi-fantôme on risque de manquer sérieusement le bateau.

    Le rédacteur a également raison lorsqu’il affirme que les militants francophones s’insurgent et s’indignent face à des histoires comme celles qui ont récemment fait la une parce que ça détruit effectivement le pilier/axe majeur de leur fiction voulant que le Québec pourrait et devrait exister tout-sans-anglais. Effectivement, les suprématistes des deux côtés essaient de nous faire croire (à tort) qu’il est tant possible que souhaitable de vivre dans une seule langue, et qu’il est tout à fait acceptable que le Québec oublie sa position de province à l’intérieur du Canada et de s’imaginer vivre dans un quasi-pays.

    Effectivement, à défaut de nous avoir livré un vrai pays pendant des générations, ces mêmes suprématistes – tant mous que militants –ont soutenu et nous font avaler collectivement des gouvernements qui votent des lois pour « faire comme si » nous étions déjà séparés. Québec « capitale nationale », « langue nationale des Québécois », « Assemblée nationale », drapeau du Québec et non du Canada occupant la place d’honneur…

    J’ai honte de ce Québec auquel ces fanatiques espèrent nous amener. Quant à moi, ce sont eux qui se trompent et qui nous vulnérabilisent.

    Il faut que des Québécois comme toi et moi cessent de se sentir et de se considérer « à part », mais d’assumer le rôle d’avant-gardistes post-nationalistes dont a péniblement besoin un Québec fatigué et essoufflé.

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  45. "Le nationalisme pour moi est une théorie échue et révolue"

    Marine LePen : 30% des intentions de vote aux prochaines présidentielles (2012) en France.

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  46. so long as authorities leave the language Zealots/Nationalists/Racists unchecked, I can foresee acts of the Terror being the next weapon of Choice for these Buffoons..

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  47. "Même si il n'y a jamais d'indépendance, le Québec (qui n'est pas limité à Montréal, la majorité de la population habitant les régions) va continuer à parler français comme il l'a fait pendant des siècles ..."

    Dude, that is the thing : there is no problem with french language in Quebec, people can speak whatever they want, but don't compare the rest of Quebec with Montreal.

    You can't even compare Quebec City with Montreal ...
    For the sake of development, THAT WILL SERVE the rest of Quebec also, Montreal should be a full bilingual city !


    P.S. And yes, your "kind" means seppie not francophone...

    ReplyDelete
  48. "...Montreal should be a full bilingual city !"

    Malheureusement nous vous avons à l'oeil.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Malheureusement, tu es probablement aveugle.

      Delete
  49. "Marine LePen : 30% des intentions de vote aux prochaines présidentielles (2012) en France. "


    Fascism with a pretty face !!!

    It's so funny to see that countries like France and Russia ( there was an youtube link abouve with some russian nazis ) are adopting this kind of nazi attitude.

    You see, in 70 years the face of fascism didn't change. What's the difference between Hitler and his beliefs and any strong nationalist like Le Pen?

    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/le-pen-fille-wants-to-make-fascism-a-family-business-6172389.html

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fnT1j5GuqoY

    Both, France and Russia suffered a lot during the world war , and now, to embrace this pro-nazi agenda is somehow disrespectful for all the heroes that died back then.

    So, to serve us examples of pro-nazi-fascism leaders of political parties from France will do no good. It shows the fact that seppies are nazis/fascists who don't see outside of the box...small minded people with little desire.

    ReplyDelete
  50. La France est dans un marasme économique et social sans précédent dû à l'immigration et à la mondialisation.20 millions de Français en ont ras le bol de voir leur pays en déconfiture.

    ReplyDelete
  51. "La France est dans un marasme économique et social sans précédent dû à l'immigration et à la mondialisation.20 millions de Français en ont ras le bol de voir leur pays en déconfiture."

    I don't want to be called racist BUT, if we analyze the truth, France committed a grave mistake: they allowed without any control whatsoever immigrants from Africa and Maghreb ! Millions of them entered France and over 70% of them had no intention of finding a job thus sucking money as welfare.

    http://www.frumforum.com/frances-assimilation-failure

    I know very well this issue, because I have family living in Paris.

    LIKE QUEBEC, they accepted immigrants, based only on the fact that they could speak french ( dialect actually ). A big mistake.

    They know are collapsing and they realize that they need to put an end to this shit, and start accepting immigrants with qualifications from other parts of Europe and Asia...immigrants with skills that can adapt quickly to market and who can work in 2 - 3 months from their arrival.

    The same mistake is seen in Quebec today: no control whatsoever for Maghreb, Haiti or African countries ( french is enough ) and lot of bureaucracy for the rest ...

    Like France, we will find ourselves in a shithole in a couple of years if you don't realize that everybody has to bring a bag of knowledge and the desire to work if they want to immigrate to Canada/Quebec. Language is not enough anymore.

    Language is essential ( english or french ) of course, but what good 1000 new immigrants with french as mother tongue from which only 10 are willing to work ???
    They end up in ghettos, sucking welfare...

    So, we need to be veeeery careful whan we put our small ideals in front of reality !!!

    ReplyDelete
  52. "I don't want to be called racist BUT..."

    ...You are!

    ReplyDelete
  53. "La France est dans un marasme économique et social sans précédent dû à l'immigration et à la mondialisation.20 millions de Français en ont ras le bol de voir leur pays en déconfiture."

    I don't want to be called racist BUT, if we analyze the truth, France committed a grave mistake: they allowed without any control whatsoever immigrants from Africa and Maghreb ! Millions of them entered France and over 70% of them had no intention of finding a job thus sucking money as welfare.

    http://www.frumforum.com/frances-assimilation-failure

    I know very well this issue, because I have family living in Paris.

    LIKE QUEBEC, they accepted immigrants, based only on the fact that they could speak french ( dialect actually ). A big mistake.

    They know are collapsing and they realize that they need to put an end to this shit, and start accepting immigrants with qualifications from other parts of Europe and Asia...immigrants with skills that can adapt quickly to market and who can work in 2 - 3 months from their arrival.

    The same mistake is seen in Quebec today: no control whatsoever for Maghreb, Haiti or African countries ( french is enough ) and lot of bureaucracy for the rest ...

    Like France, we will find ourselves in a shithole in a couple of years if you don't realize that everybody has to bring a bag of knowledge and the desire to work if they want to immigrate to Canada/Quebec. Language is not enough anymore.

    Language is essential ( english or french ) of course, but what good 1000 new immigrants with french as mother tongue from which only 10 are willing to work ???
    They end up in ghettos, sucking welfare...

    So, we need to be veeeery careful whan we put our small ideals in front of reality !!!

    ReplyDelete
  54. I don't consider myself a racist ... and I'm not. I just present the reality.

    P.S. Sorry for double post, i don't know how that happened...

    ReplyDelete
  55. Why can't we be friends, why can't we be friends

    ReplyDelete
  56. "Why can't we be friends, why can't we be friends"

    Ask our Anon-seppie friend !

    ReplyDelete
  57. The fact that the (conveniently anonymous) author can write a column such as this, demanding among other things that Québécois accept "world-wide dominance" of english, while in the same breath accusing others of being "french language supremacists" is hilariously ironic.

    Come on, come out of the shadows "No Dogs", and dare to sign your real name to go with your bigoted rantings.

    ReplyDelete
  58. To Anonymous above;
    I don't ask Quebecers to accept reality, but rather deal with reality as best they can. Pretending that English doesn't dominate the world and that Quebec can ignore that fact is a fantasy, one that you obviously share.

    As for my identity, its always amusing to be called out on it by an anonymous poster.....

    ReplyDelete
  59. Nice try, Anon 3:31PM (Damien, is that you?). I always laugh at people like you who come here to demand that Editor divulge his identity (then next thing you know, there is a brick flying through his window). I, for one, don't need to know his name. It's enough for me to read what he writes. Why are you so curious about his personal info?

    As for your point - the Quebecois are required to accept the "dominance" of English, but are then scolded when they try to assert the dominance of French...

    Nice try again.

    Here's the deal - English already IS dominant, culturally and linguistically. French (especially in North America) is nowhere near that status. Thus, accepting the "dominance" of English is accepting the natural order, whereas striving to have French replace English is to challenge that order, which is very annoying to very many people who have accepted the current state of affairs.

    Now, it would be a different kind of story if the Quebecois could change the order besides trying to change it, so that people could walk over from one side to the other. But they can't change it, and the other side simply does not exist, despite years of legislation and annoying behavior. Despite the best efforts of the Quebecois, the order stays as is with the addition of the annoyance factor generated from all the trying.

    Next, you call it "dominance" of English. I call it the worldly status. I don't find myself being dominated by the language, even though it's not my first language. But you can call it what you want. If you call it "dominance", then be it. Whatever.

    Lastly, most non-English speakers across the world have found the serenity to accept English for what it is. The notable exception are the French, who are foaming at their mouths in a fit of jealousy. But jealousy is not an attractive trait. It repels a lot of neutrals who would otherwise look at French differently.

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  60. Mais adski,vous vivez dans le seul État Nord américain ou c'est le Français qui domine.C'est vous qui n'acceptez la réalité de votre milieu...Connard.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. If French dominates, then why do you need Bill 101? Connard.

      Delete
  61. "English rocks!!!"

    Désolé,pas au Québec :)

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Yes it does. Even if you don't like it :)

      Delete
    2. Alors pourquoi les anglouilles se lamentent-ils sans cesse? :D

      Delete
    3. To catch up with the francouilles. =D

      Delete
  62. I accept where I live, and where I live
    I see a disconnect between reality and theory. In theory, this is a "state" (though missing from the map), which is entirely French (though with too much English). So it's "État Nord américain ou c'est le Français" but "sous occupation anglaise", and where "Montreal s'anglicise" constantly, (I know it sounds very schizophrenic, but aren't you seppies schizophrenic to some degree?)

    So when you say: C'est vous qui n'acceptez la réalité, you'd be more accurate to say "you don't tolerate your reality" (because I accept it as fact), just like you don't tolerate the reality of English, even though you accept its rather obvious presence around you in your "French state", and your "French metropolis". The difference between us is that you don't tolerate the existence of English, whereas I do tolerate the existence of French. What I do not tolerate is your intolerance. I want to coexist with you so that you do your thing (in French or in Swahili, I don't care) and I do my thing (in whatever language I want). But that's not enough for you, is it? Because you want me to do my thing your way. Which is too much to ask. And frankly, an annoying thing to ask.

    ReplyDelete
  63. @adski & Froggy: Excellently and succinctly put. Mille mercis!

    ReplyDelete
  64. @Apparatchik

    Ahhh. Je suis contente de voir que je ne suis pas la seule Québécoise ici qui se sent ainsi.

    Je suis tout à fait d'accord avec ton commentaire sauf sur une chose: le bout qui rejoint ce que Mr Sauga a dit.

    Perso, je ne me cache pas dans le silence en ce qui concerne ma fierté d'être CANADIENNE, d'être fédéraliste et d'être pro-blinguisme. J'ajouterais même que je suis fière d'être de droite, pour en rajouter sur mon "calvaire de mauvaise Québécoise". Quand on me pose la question, je le dis. Quand il y a des débats, je participe et suis honnête avec moi-même. Je ne suis pas du tout silencieuse. Sauf que, quel pouvoir de dissuasion ai-je? Je veux dire, j'en parle aux pro-indépendantistes que je connais, ils ne veulent rien entendre, je n'ai pas de pouvoir de presse pour écrire publiquement sur le sujet (et de toutes manières, les médias sont gauchistes avec un penchant pour l'indépendance alors tout ce qui est hors-norme, parce que nous le sommes, dérange). Alors, je n'ai pas trop le choix de me contenter de ma vie personnelle en ce qui concerne parler de ce problème. C'est pour ça que j'ai indiqué précédemment le rejet que l'on peut ressentir face à tout ça.

    --

    En ce qui concerne la France, je voterais Le Pen demain matin si j'étais Française. Oui, les Français ont fait l'erreur d'ouvrir leurs portes trop facilement à l'immigration, mais ce n'est pas une raison pour ne rien faire. De toutes manières, l'immigration musulmane n'est pas un problème juste en France... Regardez ce qui se passe en Angleterre et dans les autres pays d'Europe. Bref, je sens que l'Europe va se tourner de plus en plus vers la droite. Le nationalisme va les sauver. S'ils restaient gauchistes à lècher le cul de ceux qui sont prêt à les anéantir (jihad), ils crèveraient c'est clair.

    ReplyDelete
  65. Anonymous at 16:33,

    "Mais adski,vous vivez dans le seul État Nord américain ou c'est le Français qui domine.C'est vous qui n'acceptez la réalité de votre milieu...Connard."

    Even if you were right and French was dominant, so what? Remember, WIIFM. As me, for example. I live my life almost completely in English. I get services (private and public) in English. My wife and I work in English. We live in an English neighborhood. My child goes to an EMSB school. So please, give me one good reason. Why must I Francisize myself and my family?

    Or what? You want to legislate that I only receive service in French, even when provided by non-francophone? You want my place of work to function in French? You want that everybody around me speak French? You want to prevent me to leave Quebec border? Why should all the parties I mention above comply with what you want?

    ReplyDelete
  66. "Even if you were right and French was dominant, so what? Remember, WIIFM. As me, for example. I live my life almost completely in English. I get services (private and public) in English. My wife and I work in English. We live in an English neighborhood. My child goes to an EMSB school."

    Aucune raison de vous plaindre alors.Nous ne sommes pas des sauvages,nous traitons bien nos minorités.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. And Canadians treat you, as a minority, well. God Bless The Queen!

      Delete
  67. @Gen:

    > Je suis contente de voir que je ne suis pas la seule Québécoise ici qui se sent ainsi.

    J’ose le dire encore une fois : tu n’es certainement pas la seule et je parierais que beaucoup plus de gens chez nous pensent comme toi et moi officieusement si ce n’est pas officiellement.

    > Je suis tout à fait d'accord avec ton commentaire sauf sur une chose: le bout qui rejoint ce que Mr Sauga a dit.

    Mr. Sauga dit plein de choses, alors il va falloir que tu soies plus précise. Comme j’ai dit plus haut, je ne suis pas toujours d’accord avec certaines idées qu’il véhicule et défend, mais je crois qu’il a absolument raison de jeter le blâme sur ces Québécois qui demeurent passifs ou qui se laissent réduire à une passivité par voie d’intimidation. Ce n’est pas toujours celui qui crie le plus haut et plus fort qui a nécessairement raison, et le fait d’appartenir (ou de s’autoidentifier) à une majorité quelconque ne donne pas en soi raison. Tout comme nous francophones n’avons pas à abandonner nos symboles d’appartenance (dont notamment notre langue) pour la seule raison d’être minoritaires sur ce continent, je crois que nos dirigeants encouragent à leur tour une insidieuse tyrannie de la majorité contre nos propres minorités linguistiques ici même au Québec lorsqu’ils sortent ce même discours (au Québec donc tout en français) chez nous.

    > Perso, je ne me cache pas dans le silence en ce qui concerne ma fierté d'être CANADIENNE, d'être fédéraliste et d'être pro-blinguisme […].

    Moi itou. Et chapeau. De mon côté, je n’ai jamais accepté l’argument de la pente glissante selon lequel une fois qu’on aura appris à parler anglais on voudra nécessairement abandonner notre langue d’origine. Une langue, ça meurt lorsque ses locuteurs décident qu’elle ne leur est plus de service. Pourtant, nous avons une langue, des institutions terminologiques, et une masse critique. Ou bien nos dirigeants croient si peu en notre langue qu’ils croient pouvoir la rendre plus attrayante en lui donnant un monopole artificiel ou bien ils croient encore moins en nous, locuteurs (et autres francophiles) ainsi qu’à notre volonté et détermination de pouvoir porter fièrement ce fardeau coute que coute. D’une façon comme d’une autre, ça m’insulte – c’est un discours et une logique un peu trop paternalistes sur fond quasi-missionnaire – comme si mon éloignement du pécher que représente l’anglais (voire même me sentir comme partie intégrante dans deux communautés) ça frôle le pécher originel… En tout cas je me casse pas trop la tête ; je vis ma vie et je n’hésite pas à parler fièrement de mon pays et de ma province sans jamais confondre l’un avec l’autre.

    > J'ajouterais même que je suis fière d'être de droite, pour en rajouter sur mon "calvaire de mauvaise Québécoise"

    Ouf ! T’en tartines gros ! Déjà au centre (moi) ça va assez mal par moments...

    > Sauf que, quel pouvoir de dissuasion ai-je?

    Prêche par l’exemple. Montre-leur qu’être bilingue n’est pas synonyme d’être colonisée. Et que s’il y en a des « colonisés », ce sont bien ceux qui se laissent remplir la tête de peurs insécurisantes. Le fait même que tu puisses vivre deux réalités sans heurts et de façon tellement transparente vaut déjà son pesant d’or. S’il y a quelque chose qui les mènera à une combustion spontanée, c’est certes l’idée qu’une Québécoise francophone (pour ne pas dire Canadienne-Française) peut réussir des deux côtés de la clôture sans pour autant oublier comment rentrer chez elle.

    (1)

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  68. > […] je n'ai pas de pouvoir de presse pour écrire publiquement sur le sujet

    Es-tu nouvelle ici ? Lis-tu vigile ? As-tu vu d’autres blogues ? Que t’écrives publiquement ou anonymement, il faut commencer par faire sortir tes idées de la pénombre.

    C’est d’ailleurs pour ça que je suis reconnaissant au Rédacteur (Editor) pour avoir l’audace d’écrire tout haut ce que bon nombre de gens comme moi (je sais qu’on est nombreux – j’ai de nombreuses connaissances pour le prouver) ont toujours pensé tout bas. Et le fait que ce premier permet une discussion ouverte sur son blogue – dans la langue de mon choix et avec une modération très… modérée – me porte à croire qu’il s’agit d’un tremplin tout à fait idéal pour faire véhiculer les notions post-nationalistes tant attendues (et nécessaires), surtout par les temps qui courent.

    > Alors, je n'ai pas trop le choix de me contenter de ma vie personnelle en ce qui concerne parler de ce problème. C'est pour ça que j'ai indiqué précédemment le rejet que l'on peut ressentir face à tout ça.

    Avec respect, peut-être te faudrait-il un nouveau cercle d’amis. Si tu es vraiment aussi biculturelle que tu le prétends, tu devrais tôt ou tard rencontrer du monde qui, sans nécessairement partager toutes tes orientations politiques pourra assez respectueusement essayer de voir d’où tu viens et où tu t’en vas sans avoir à t’effacer.

    > En ce qui concerne la France, je voterais Le Pen demain matin si j'étais Française.

    Ayoye ! Peut être un peu beaucoup plus à droite que moi… mais lisons ce que t’as à dire…

    > Oui, les Français ont fait l'erreur d'ouvrir leurs portes trop facilement à l'immigration […] je sens que l'Europe va se tourner de plus en plus vers la droite. Le nationalisme va les sauver. S'ils restaient gauchistes à lècher le cul de ceux qui sont prêt à les anéantir (jihad), ils crèveraient c'est clair.

    Décidément, tu es plus nativiste que moi. On s’entend par contre sur le danger que pose une immigration trop facile, mal réussie et myope qui finit par créer une classe de gens peu adaptés/adaptables à leur environnement. VOILÀ où se sont trompées les sociétés occidentales, crois-je humblement. Toutefois, je doute que la solution réside dans le nationalisme en soi car je considère celui-ci comme étant trop souvent et facilement assimilé à la loi de la foule (elle-même nécessairement) homogène. S’en tenir de façon exagérée aux symboles et aux mythes de la nation, c’est se plier aveuglément à une histoire inventée par des démagogues et de condamner (tout en s’autocondamnant) à exister dans un cadre de référence sclérosé et tribal, avec tendances plus souvent xénophobes que modérées. Allô les consultations sur les pratiques d’accommodements raisonnables ?! On aurait dit – en écoutant certains commentaires de certains Québécois de souche – qu’ils n’avaient jamais vu ni connu autre chose qu’un Canadien-Français blanc et catholique.

    Ainsi, le débat, où que l’on soit, n’est jamais noir ou blanc, mais teinté de gris. Voilà pourquoi je me sens dans l’obligation de tenter la modération plutôt que le protectionnisme.

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  69. > Even if you were right and French was dominant, so what? Remember, WIIFM. As me, for example. I live my life almost completely in English. I get services (private and public) in English. My wife and I work in English. We live in an English neighborhood. My child goes to an EMSB school. So please, give me one good reason. Why must I Francisize myself and my family?

    With all due respect, while I don’t believe that coercion – legislative or otherwise – is the way to go to force someone in one specific direction, I can’t think our Anonymous troll is necessarily entirely wrong. I certainly agree with the freedom of choice; if you really want to live your entire life in English especially when most of your neighbors live in French, then I suppose you’re shutting yourself out by choice – and you’ll have to bear the consequences, both good and bad. But don’t you think you’d have more to gain by achieving something akin to a seamless integration between both cultures and languages? Wouldn’t you be profiting more by exploiting the situation of relative diversity that you could effectively condition for yourself?

    And just in case you think I’m unfairly criticizing you, let me present a parallel. A lot of francophones might look at the flip-side of the proposition and also ask, in turn, WIIFM. And they would, I think, be just as right as you are to do so. After all, English isn’t THEIR language either. And my observation would respectfully be the same – why deliberately cut yourself off from a world of opportunity by taking on a pseudo-opportunistic premise that in all likelihood will in all likelihood REDUCE your opportunities?

    (3)

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  70. "...Montreal should be a full bilingual city !"



    And there is nothing you can do whatsoever to keep it from taking over the City…face it, you are powerless to the situation and your very own elites are very well aware of the consequences if they dare making any further attempt to wipe it out completely… besides, I highly doubt they truly care about the state of French in Montreal, they have got better things to do in their everyday lives and are preoccupied by more important matters... Sorry, but your quest to save French in Montreal, is nothing but an illusionary concept and frankly, it’s getting increasingly old as time goes by and you should just perhaps drop it for once and for all.

    « Aucune raison de vous plaindre alors.Nous ne sommes pas des sauvages,nous traitons bien nos minorités. »

    Wow, speaking of sauvage, you surely do remind me of some!!! The only difference was, their level of intelligence was far superior to yours and were more civilized.


    ENGLISH ROCKS


    When British and American bands as well as Celine Dion come in town and give concerts, YES IT DOES and you know it!!! :)

    Buddy, you need to wise and smarten up if you want to make comment that can’t be counter-argued because you suck very much at it and need slack down on your dosage of laurentide booze. It ain’t good for you brain cells, you know.

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  71. This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

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  72. "...you are powerless to the situation and your very own elites are very well aware of the consequences if they dare making any further attempt to wipe it out completely…"

    Nous travaillons sur ce dossier de façon intensive.On cherche activement l'angle (ou les angles) d'attaque.

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    1. Wow, copying and pasting the same phrases over and over. What intelligence you must have!

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  73. ...to Roger Rabbitt on the 9th @ 11:55pm: You wrote "I don't think you can ever blame francophones for not standing up for anglophones when anglophones don't even stand up for themselves."

    Give that man a cigar! Excellent point, and I cannot argue against that! You're absolutely right, and that was my case clincher for making my mind up to leave Quebec at the tender age of 16. It took time to finalize my departure as I wanted to complete my education before doing so, but the day after my convocation at Concordia U., I set up house in Ottawa.

    While at times my parents and their cohorts talked a good fight, but most of them made it quite clear they were established and relocating would have been too hard. They became completely complacent, and I felt too many became complacent. Over 300,000 anglophones have left Quebec since 1976 (my decision was made in 1974 with the advent of Bill 22). Others decided to stay, and that was their choice. I am a more political animal than most of those who chose to stay, esp of my cohorts. I guess some figured they'd handle the French exam to obtain their professional licenses, and the less educated figured you can still live in Montreal with little French, or they picked up enough to get by because they couldn't bother moving. Others yet had escape plans if worse came to worst (i.e., separation actually happened). My parents and others near or over age 50 figured they were sitting ducks and just hoped for the best.

    I was not prepared to be a sitting duck! I simply could not stand the complacency, and so I left.

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  74. "face it, you are powerless to the situation and your very own elites are very well aware of the consequences if they dare making any further attempt to wipe it out completely..."

    N'oubliez jamais que nous vous tolérons parce que vous n'êtes pas trop bruillant et obéissez relativement bien à nos lois.Les occasionnelles manifestations des Québécois n'est qu'un petit rappel à l'ordre afin de vous rediriger à votre place chez-nous,c'est à dire une simple minorité sans voix.

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    1. You are the minority with no voice that we tolerate. That's why you come on this blog, cher Canadien.

      Delete
  75. Troy: "Even if you were right and French was dominant, so what? Remember, WIIFM. As me, for example. I live my life almost completely in English. I get services (private and public) in English. My wife and I work in English. We live in an English neighborhood. My child goes to an EMSB school."

    Anon 10:49PM: "Aucune raison de vous plaindre alors.Nous ne sommes pas des sauvages,nous traitons bien nos minorités. "

    ----

    Just because there is no immediate reason to worry, it doesn't mean there is no reason to be annoyed. You people don't worry us, you annoy us, and therein lies the reason to complain. Just like flies that buzz around your head - they can't exact any major damage (like a bee or a mosquito could), but they sure do annoy you to the point that you complain (I hope my analogy with shit flies hits home for you Anon).

    As for your second sentence, it's not that you treat minorities well, it's that you're powerless to treat them the way you'd love to treat them. There is major difference between the two. Just like the presence of English doesn't testify to the grandiosity of Bill 101, the existence of the minorities in Quebec doesn't testify to the grandiosity of Quebec nationalists. It testifies more to their powerlessness.

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  76. Ne vous en faites pas adski.Celà fera bientôt 400 ans que nous ajustons constamment le tir avec les anglos.L'aménagement linguistique ,vous connaissez?Un peu comme quand vous jugez qu'il est temps de faire le ménage dans votre 3 1/2 lorsque les mouches commencent à se multiplier.

    Une simple question d'hygiène :)

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    1. 400 ans of nothing meaningfull and constructive!!!

      Delete
    2. Separatist propaganda. We lived together, each side making adjustments over hundreds of years. It's only recently that there have been problems, all caused by separatists.

      Delete
  77. Apparatchik,

    Why can we not live and let live? If by living the way I described I am happy and do not bother anyone, why do they bother me and ask me to change my lifestyle? Remember, 'I' here is not just Troy, but also others like me. If, by living my lifestyle I put myself in disadvantage, is it not my problem? If, as a paying customer I demand service in English and the provider wants my business, how is it anybody else's matter?

    To extend this premise, if the English or ethnic community are happy to live their lives, why must the 'majority' bother? As long as we do not bother them and we can communicate well with them, I really do not see what the logical problem is.

    Let me give examples. National Bank of Canada. A number of protesters do not even have account there. Those who do are served well in French. Why is it their problem that the IT Director is English? Bombardier. The employees are happy working there. Of course. Bombardier Aerospace pays good. Why bother? Canadiens. The Bell Center is sold out for decades. Fans watch RDS and Center Ice. Those wo do not watch, why bother?

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  78. "It testifies more to their powerlessness."

    Qui a le contrôle du volume kiki?

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  79. Troy: "why must the 'majority' bother?"

    It's a combination of nature and nurture. If one has a biological predisposition to anti-social behavior and happens to reside in a society whose elites encourage such behavior, he will evolve over time into a neurotic type oblivious to social conventions that apply in civilized societies.

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    1. Seriez-vous immunisé contre toutes influences,adski?

      Delete
  80. @Anonymous 11:22AM

    "Ne vous en faites pas adski.Celà fera bientôt 400 ans que nous ajustons constamment le tir avec les anglos.L'aménagement linguistique ,vous connaissez?Un peu comme quand vous jugez qu'il est temps de faire le ménage dans votre 3 1/2 lorsque les mouches commencent à se multiplier.

    Une simple question d'hygiène :)"

    Si après 400 ans vous avez toujours pas appris à faire le ménage comme du monde, faudrait peut-être que vous finissez par comprendre que vivre avec un peu de saleté et de microbes est bon pour le système: ça le renforci et ça développe des anticorps. :)

    (Pas que je crois que les anglos sont de la saleté ou des microbes, c'est une figure de style bien entendu)

    --

    @Apparatchik

    Je ne suis pas vraiment nouvelle ici, mais je commente très rarement. Peut-être que commenter plus souvent me donnerait un "pouvoir de presse" plus grand ou si je me mèlais plus à d'autres sites, mais je suis activiste pour d'autres causes que je juge plus importantes que le rapport anglais-français. J'en parle ici parce que c'est le "main purpose" du site, mais en général je me contente de lire car ça prend quand même beaucoup de temps et d'énergie toutes ces discussions. Mais de temps en temps, je viens donner mon grain de sel. Tu ne me reconnais peut-être pas parce que ça faisait un bon moment que je n'étais pas venue dire de quoi (au moins 6 mois). Alors non, j'irai pas sur Vigile ou autre pour défendre quoique ce soit. De toutes manières, avec ces zealots, c'est pire que pire. Aussi bien parler dans le vide.

    Pour la droite, malheureusement pour l'Europe, je crois qu'il va falloir passer par cet extrême (je ne suis pas pour l'extrême droite, mais pour une droite, oui). Il faut passer d'une extrême à une autre pour retrouver le juste milieu et entre la droite de Le Pen pour la France et l'extrémiste islamique, je choisis Le Pen à 100%.

    Et ce problème que l'Europe vit nous allons le vivre (et nous avons déjà commencé d'ailleurs) ici en Amérique du Nord. Et comme nous sommes trop épais pour regarder ce qui se passe de l'autre côté de l'océan et comprendre, nous continuons avec notre politically correct et notre go-gauche trop tolérante ça va arriver ici.

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  81. @ Troy:

    I agree with you that people can choose to live their life in English or French. It should not be up to politicians to decide for us. It's always good to know another language but when there are hardcore "nationalists" forcing you to do something, it's not the same as you choosing to do something of your own volition. I saw a youtube video about the bill 101 protest and one black guy was saying that he understands that francophones want to preserve their language but why don't they, instead of forcing it down people's throats, say "Hey, you don't know French? Why don't you come and I'll teach you a few words" in a friendly manner. I'm paraphrasing what he said but you get my gist. I don't mind the promotion of a language to keep it vibrant but the restriction of another language is not something I believe in. The way some "nationalists" approach things is very off-putting.

    @ Mr.Sauga:

    I do understand why you made the decision you made to leave Montreal and unfortunately, it's not only anglophones that left. There were many bilingual francophones as well. Montreal is poorer for that loss. I think there is still a place in your heart for Montreal. That's part of the reason you come to this site, I figure. You can always move back. There's always room for 1 more anglophone. Wouldn't you like to move back just to piss the separatists off? :)

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  82. Since I couldn’t reply directly to that moronic buffoon who keeps trolling around and posting mindless comments, I just decided to do it the good old method just to send the messages back to him/her, or whatever that specimen is.



    The same goes for you, as part of minority yourself; you are trapped in a dead-end with your beloved movement that’s losing steam, well on its way to the cemetery, with no hope of making a comeback…



    That’s right! keep talking as though you were all determined to act upon your intentions when in fact you are too chicken shit to do shit about it…typical of a seppie, all talk, no action…oh btw, even if you had something in mind, I highly doubt you would be smart and wise enough to carry out your plans in an effective way because the way it sounded like, didn’t sound very promising and impressive whatsoever.



    We do and let me tell you something pal, you are continuously losing grounds and we are increasingly picking up yards… down the line, we’ll see who’s going have the last laugh…and it certainly not going to be you as a result…


    A state that should not have any power whatsoever to dictate people what language to choose since it does not technically have any entitlement to have a unilingual status and which is also, dying out economically all because of its stubbornness and unwillingness not to join in with the rest of North America…you should just man up and start being realistic instead of paranoing over the fact that your language is constantly under English threat…it’s time to grow some hair on your balls and quit being so childish, because you guys surely act like immature prebucsent teens and I’m not the only one saying that. Actually, the whole world says the same way.

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  83. actually this is the right copy, sorry!!!
    Since I couldn’t reply directly to that moronic buffoon who keeps trolling around and posting mindless comments, I just decided to do it the good old method just to send the messages back to him/her, or whatever that specimen is.

    N'oubliez jamais que nous vous tolérons parce que vous n'êtes pas trop bruillant et obéissez relativement bien à nos lois.Les occasionnelles manifestations des Québécois n'est qu'un petit rappel à l'ordre afin de vous rediriger à votre place chez-nous,c'est à dire une simple minorité sans voix.

    The same goes for you, as part of minority yourself; you are trapped in a dead-end with your beloved movement that’s losing steam, well on its way to the cemetery, with no hope of making a comeback…

    Nous travaillons sur ce dossier de façon intensive.On cherche activement l'angle (ou les angles) d'attaque.

    That’s right! keep talking as though you were all determined to act upon your intentions when in fact you are too chicken shit to do shit about it…typical of a seppie, all talk, no action…oh btw, even if you had something in mind, I highly doubt you would be smart and wise enough to carry out your plans in an effective way because the way it sounded like, didn’t sound very promising and impressive whatsoever.

    Qui a le contrôle du volume kiki?

    We do and let me tell you something pal, you are continuously losing grounds and we are increasingly picking up yards… down the line, we’ll see who’s going have the last laugh…and it certainly not going to be you as a result…


    Mais adski,vous vivez dans le seul État Nord américain ou c'est le Français qui domine.C'est vous qui n'acceptez la réalité de votre milieu...Connard

    A state that should not have any power whatsoever to dictate people what language to choose since it does not technically have any entitlement to have a unilingual status and which is also, dying out economically all because of its stubbornness and unwillingness not to join in with the rest of North America…you should just man up and start being realistic instead of paranoing over the fact that your language is constantly under English threat…it’s time to grow some hair on your balls and quit being so childish, because you guys surely act like immature prebucsent teens and I’m not the only one saying that. Actually, the whole world says the same way. Connard

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    1. "...and it certainly not going to be you as a result"

      Hmmmmmm.Je n'hésiterais pas une seconde à parier là d'sus.Vous devriez réfléchir un peu plus avant d'écrire.Beaucoup de mots pour ne rien dire.Faites comme moi,soyez succinct.

      Delete
    2. "A state that should not have any power whatsoever to dictate people what language to choose since it does not technically have any entitlement to have a unilingual status..."

      Avez-vous terminé votre secondaire?

      Delete
    3. "...the whole world says the same way."

      Nous sommes une société distincte.

      Delete
    4. Yup, distincte ... you are distincte not because you're quebecois, it's because there are 100000 nations that live in peace here. That makes a society so distinct. So stop flatter yourselves ... on your own, les quebecois would be drunk farmers,nothing else. AND OF COURSE inbreeds.

      Delete
    5. "AND OF COURSE inbreeds"

      Vous vous trompez de race,je vous dit celà sous toutes réserves.

      Delete
  84. ''Le colonialiste fait du colonisé un portrait mystificateur. Mais le colonisé, dépourvu de tout droit, constamment soumis et humilié, et en état permanent de carence, est souvent amené à se conformer au miroir qu'on lui tend. Certains tentent bien de s'assimiler, et donc de s'aliéner culturellement, mais l'assimilation, refusée par le colonisateur, n'est qu'un mirage. La révolte est donc inévitable. Pour assurer la cohésion du mouvement de révolte, l'élite des colonisés en arrive souvent à affirmer les « valeurs refuges », régressives, que sont la tradition, la famille et, plus encore, la religion, ce qui est lourd de dangers, une fois l'indépendance obtenue.''Portrait du colonisé par Albert Memmi, publié en mai 1957 chez Buchet/Chastel

    Ça me rappelle la vision fédéraliste canadienne ! :)

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  85. Anonymous Jan 12, 2012 06:47 AM, Would you please come out of the shadow and reveal you true identity...My name is John Jame Jones and I live in Westmount...Now that I've revealed you mine, how about you reveal me yours...that way, I would know who I'm addressing myself to...

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    1. Mon nom est manche de pelle et j'habite à Kingston, satisfait ?

      Delete
    2. Âdalarasu Manou,Je suis tenancier d'un Donut shop à Mississauga.

      Delete
    3. Is this a site for fiction? If you can't comment about the debate Anonymous Adalarasu Manuou, then please find something else to do.

      Delete
  86. ok Manche de pelle, now that you have told me!!! how do you make a living??? do you work somewhere???or is trolling on this site actually your full time job, tell me???

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    1. Je fais le déneigement de nuit des stationnements commerciaux,dont celui de Monsieur Âdalarasu Manou,fier propriétaire du Donut Kingdom.

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    2. This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

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    3. Anonymous 7:02PM please find a job if you're not going to make rational statements. Trolling is not a way to promote your option. If you don't have reason behind your option, then maybe you should forget about it.

      Delete