Tuesday, September 7, 2010

Ouch!!!!! Friday's Blog Piece Hits a Nerve

My piece on Friday provoked some strong reaction by French language militants, some even rising to the level of hate. I've printed a couple of these comments so that readers can get an understanding of the level of malevolence, language militants bear to those who disagree with them. I didn't print a slew of others, all bearing the same theme theme of "Get the "F" out of Quebec , if you don't like it.' and other racist missives.

Of course none of those comments offered any sort of rebuttal to the piece that I wrote, the premise being that hysteria by French language militants over English and Bill 101, are driving francophones and allophones towards English education.

Instead, the comments included the obligatory ad hominem attacks on myself for blogging anonymously, coupled with a rehash of the same-old/same-old hackneyed ideas and misleading statistics that are the bread and butter of the French language/sovereignist militant machine.

I'm not sure what these militants want to accomplish by posting their nonsense to our little blog, if they're not going to make any rational arguments, their hysterical anglophobia is mis-directed.
I guess I must have pushed a button that triggered a certain wave of frustration and anger which bubbled over. All I can say is, tough noogis...

There is nothing these militants hate worse than being called out on the facts, they are used to preaching to the converted. They pump out falsehoods and use misleading and doctored statistics as a matter of course  and are outraged when these myths are challenged by skeptics.

Readers on this blog, I'm glad to say, are not the saps who lap up the lame hysterical mantra passed off as fact by the Mario Beaulieus and Louis Prefontaines of the militant sovereignist movement. We remain unimpressed and defiant. I myself have felt the sharp end of a criticism from readers and that's a good thing!

Readers have already offered some interesting critiques of the nonsense spouted by Mr. Prefontaine.
Congratualtions! 'Adski' , 'Appatchik' and 'Troy' and others! You have given me one less column to write!

BTW, Mr. Prefontaine, as adski pointed pointed out, I have already written about  The Myth of the Overfinancing of English Universities.

I will however add this;

By claiming that Anglophone schools are over-financed, you intimate that francophone schools are under-financed.

This simply isn't true.
Francophone education is in a catastrophic state of decline that has nothing to do with anglos, ethnics or allophones, or financing, for that matter.

If anglophone institutions are over-financed (and they are not) it is because francophones just don't go to cegep and university in the same proportion as anglos and allos. 
Those francophones and allophones who go to anglo institutions are numerically insignificant in comparison with the simple fact that francophones are just less interested in higher eduction.

Now I know this is hard to swallow, so let me back it up with facts.

First of all, francophones value education less than Anglophones. 


Read a highly interesting report on this and other problems in the Quebec educational system.

It's hard to fill universities and cegeps when students don't finish high school. The high school dropout rate amongst francophones, especially boys has become a critical indictment  of the francophone educational system.
In a letter to the Journal de Montreal former sovereignist Premier Jacques Parizeau was 'scandalized' by the poor performance of francophone high schoolers as compared to their anglophone counterparts.
"Premier Jacques Parizeau wrote a newspaper article drawing attention to the high dropout rate among among boys. He cited government statistics on high-school completion rates as of 2007, showing that in Montréal French-language public schools 63 percent of girls and only 49 percent of boys had graduated seven years after entering secondary studies. The comparable statistics in Montreal English- language public schools were 86 percent for girls and 79 percent for boys. “Why,” he asked, “are the results of [Quebec’s] English-language school system so much better than those of the French-language system?” 
read;  Dropouts: The Achilles' Heel of Canada's High-School System
I wonder if Mr. Prefontaine will blame the poor performance of francophone high school students on the over-financing of the the English high school boards?

Finally one last sad  piece of evidence, here's a bar graph indicating the different graduation rates from university:


Yup, Anglos earn almost 50% more university degrees than francophones, per capita. Allophones do even better!

I know it's sad and I know it's infuriating to have an anglo like myself bring these facts to light. There is a problem in the French educational system but it hasn't got anything to do with money or anglos.

To my francophone friends, I tell you that I take no pleasure in revealing this sad state of affairs.
Something has to be done pro-actively to get francophones back in school where they belong. Other studies show that when they do stay in university, they do just as well as anglophones.

Perpetuating myths and spreading falsehoods is what language militants do, blaming anglos and Canada for everything under the sun, instead of looking at the unvarnished truth that faces them in the mirror.

I know that in reaction to this piece, someone, somewhere is trying to spin the facts to prove otherwise, but the truth is, the Anglo education system is infinitely more successful, to the point that the very best francophone students want in.

Instead of trying to destroy the Anglo system, perhaps it would be better to try and emulate it, but alas it's easier to whine.

If you don't like my words, then debate them. If you can't or won't, well.... bring on the racist anti-English rants, we're all used to them. But I won't be printing any more of your crap.

PS. Note to Louis Prefontaine;
That was your one free shot.
Don't ever think that you can come around again and insult me like a moronic twit on my own blog.... If you want to slag me, do it on your own blog.

56 comments:

  1. "Instead of trying to destroy the Anglo system, perhaps it would be better to try and emulate it, but alas it's easier to whine."

    Goose that laid the golden eggs,
    Fear,
    Jealousy,
    Restricted access,
    No free choice for children,
    Blame game.


    There, I got the pieces out. Somebody put it together now.

    btw, Editor:
    "If you don't like my words, then debate them [...] I won't be printing any more of your crap."
    Small question: can I keep responding bilingually?

    ReplyDelete
  2. Mississauga Guy said...

    Yet another reason why the rest of us don't need Quebec in the fold. Interestingly, though, how the Prairie Provinces are guilty as well, but it's mostly limited to Aboriginal people. Sad to state that perhaps sometimes Howard Galganov is right. As he has written in the past on his blog, Galganov Dot Com, the Aboriginals will not be happy unless and until they have 100% of North America back, and that won't happen, but like French Quebec, they feel they could just sit all day on their asses and be owed special privileges instead of getting off their asses, getting an education and doing something with themeselves.

    I've been trying to give the Aboriginals the benefit of every doubt for decades, but when I read these things, when I hear that their rates of suicide, alcoholism, homicide and other destructive and self-destructive social behaviour, I have to wonder if government is doing things wrong. Aboriginals are given preferences when looking for federal government jobs, they have autonomy on their reservations, I heard on the news recently they had first dibs on the bumper crop of salmon in the waters of B.C., and yet they don't seem to collectively improve their lots in life.

    More often than not, they get frustrated until they create blockades of roads, bridges and railroad tracks. Ontario Provincial Police Chief Julian Fantino finally had the gonads to do what too many feds don't do. He warned the troublemakers to take down their highway and railroad track blockades or the police would do so by force. Damn good for him!!! It worked. There was some minor enforcement by the OPP and a few arrests, but they backed down.

    I personally believe the Aboriginals should have to pay for any property damages they cause AND lost economic activity, by deducting what is allocated to them in federal and provincial budgets and forwarding those monies to whoever suffered losses as restitution.

    Getting back to Quebec, and the provinces with substandard drop-out rates, there too should be some sort reduction of Equalization and other transfer payments as a result of poor performance. Since education falls under provincial jurisdiction, then provinces that don't put extra efforts into enriching the education of the pupils under their tutelage should be penalized. Give them three years to implement a program that doesn't leave so many children behind, then phase in penalties for provinces not taking action to correct their shortcomings.

    Quebec in its French schools sadly fills the skulls of their students with complete mush about hoe the maudit anglais shortchanged them every step of the way through history. Michel Gratton wrote a book called French Canadians in the 1990s to teach the Anglophone community in Canada about the goings-on in the French speaking society, both in and outside Quebec.

    Gratton's description of education in the French schools was scathing, from the lack of the 3 R's in the curriculum to the ridiculous literature being assigned for reading to the religious fanaticism by the religious schools.

    French Quebec has only itself to blame for falling behind the English system, but of course nothing is their fault and everything is the fault of, as Parizeau the Parisite once said, "money and the ethnic [vote]"

    Quebec's population is aging, the number of university graduates graduating in Quebec is low. They're the ones causing most of the fiscal drag, and so for all their bellyaching about being unfairly treated, they are the cause of their own demise. I certainly think it's time to take Canada back from Quebec.

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  3. "Instead, the comments included the obligatory ad hominem attacks on myself for blogging anonymously..."

    Nous n'avons jamais eu aucune réponse.Honte ou peur? Association a un groupe extrémiste mal aimé ? Vous êtes le seul anonyme sur la blogosphère d'intérêts sociaux et politiques.C'est tout a fait normal que cela éveille la curiosité de certains.Que diriez-vous si un blogue a revendications (extrèmes ou non) inverses aux vôtres agissait de la sorte? Êtes-vous vraiment convaincu de vos idées?Ou est-ce simplement de l'agitation inutile?

    ReplyDelete
  4. Les statistiques ne sont pas votre fort... Par sur-financement, ont veut dire le montant alloué en proportion du nombre d'étudiants inscrits. Ça n'a rien à voir avec le nombre de francophones qui vont poursuivre des études postsecondaires. Il y a manifestement de la mauvaise foi, répétons: les anglos-québécois sont à peine 9% à 10% de la population.

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  5. Devrions-nous financer un système scolaire aux différents représentants de communautés asiatiques, sud-américaines, africaines et ainsi de suite ? Votre raisonnement n'a aucun sens et démontre bien votre mauvaise foi. Le système public anglophone est pour ce 9 à 10 %, c'est tout. Pour ceux qui pensent que parler anglais règle tous les problèmes d'injustices, allez voir à Washington, Ottawa, Londres, le nombre de laissés-pour-compte dans ces états qui font la leçon à tout le monde entier ! Méfiez-vous de ceux qui croient détenir les vertus morales de ce monde. Si vous voulez le libre choix à l'éducation, on devrait commencer à dispenser des cours en espagnol dans certains États des États-Unis, en mandarin à Vancouver, en ourdou à Toronto et Londres et ainsi de suite... Comme dirait les ados ''pas rapport''...

    ''Une langue qui ne s’appuie pas sur une base politique territoriale solide est appelée à se folkloriser et à se marginaliser en tant qu’instrument social commun de communication. Il serait peut-être temps que les Québécois francophones décident une fois pour toutes s’ils forment un peuple normal et décident d’agir en tant que tel.''

    - Rodrigue Tremblay

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  6. I am glad to see that the quality of the level of comments opposing my view has been raised and that arguments and ideas have replaced personal attacks.

    I will repeat for the last time why I blog anonymously. I have a job and a family which I do not want threatened. If you think this is not a concern you are wrong. Ask Barbara Charlebois or Howard Galganov who received threat after threat for political views. As long as the Jeunes Patriots and the RRQ say and do what they do, those who speak publicly against them are in danger.
    I repeat that I am not a politician, an ex-politician and not a member of any political party, lobby group or any such sort. I am an anglo who has lived and worked in Quebec all my life.
    If my identity is of interest to you past this, I must ask why?

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  7. “Une langue qui ne s’appuie pas sur une base politique territoriale solide est appelée à se folkloriser et à se marginaliser en tant qu’instrument social commun de communication.”

    By corollary, a language that is imposed too hard may also end up folkloric and marginalized. The key is to recognize your limits and find moderate solutions. Trying too hard is often counterproductive. And there is such a thing as knowing when to quit.

    ReplyDelete
  8. Voici quelques statistiques qui pourraient intéresser quelques-uns parmi vous.En espérant que ce blogue a vraiment comme but d'informer les Québécois,Francos et Anglos.

    http://louisprefontaine.com/2010/09/07/etude-irfa-cegep-anglais

    ReplyDelete
  9. Anon 9:56AM: "Méfiez-vous de ceux qui croient détenir les vertus morales de ce monde."

    One must always take political moralizing (or anything they say) with a grain of salt. And that goes for politicians of all stripes or colors. Same with religious figures of all denominations, with a few RARE exceptions.

    The problem with a guy like Anon 9:56AM is that he will shun the advice of those in London, Washington, and Ottawa, but he will uncritically and blindly follow the advice of those in Quebec City. Even though the ones from “la capitale nationale” are cut from the same cloth as those from la capitale federale.

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  10. Mississauga Guy said...

    The more these same-old-same-olds spew their vitriol in French, the more I see these backwood Sagueneens and Lac-St-Jeanois as a hillbillydom. They spew in French what the ignoramuses of the Confederate American States spew in English. Only thing these Franco bumpkins are missing are their robes, masks and hats to fit their pointy heads.

    I imagine most of these greasy-haired Franco hicks are amongst those who are not high school grah-joo-8s!

    This Roddy Tremblay above fits the mold perfectly. HEY RODDY: There is NO law against parochial schools in the United States or Canada. I would imagine most of Western Europe as well has nothing against parochial schools either. Mandarin and Spanish have much more economic influence than French, that's for sure! I see the Americas forming a trade bloc in the future, and with 1.3 billion Chinese people making daily gains economically, their affluence is improving rapidly so learning Mandarin to sell to a market in excess of a billion people makes good sense...and lots of dollars, too!

    Similarly, with Asians forming a trade bloc along with Oceania as time goes on, and the already existing European Union, an Americas trade agreement inevitably will be on the way. You'll have about 340 million English speakers, 330 million Spanish speakers, 184 million Portuguese speakers (in Brazil) and less than ten million French speakers. So Hot Rod, will it be English, Spanish or Portuguese? You and six million other Francophones in Quebec must start to make choices. Bonne chance!

    Also, America doesn't have two official languages. Canada does, and like it or not, Hot Rod, English speakers make up a significant and rich part of Quebec history. The fact revisionists like yourself, Préfontaine, Beaulieu and a host of others want to turn your backs on it and other English institutions that have probably done more to date than your French ones ever will confirms your disdain with everything not of your collective ilk.

    Just remember, Jean Chrétien of his own free will had his recent brain surgery performed at the Jewish General Hospital in Montreal, two hours from where he lives. Jacques Parizeau, the parasite that he is, recently spent a medical furlough at that same medical insitution of his own free will. Not Cité de la Santé, not Hôtel Dieu, but again, the Jewish General Hospital, and he stated that was satisfied with the treatment he received during his stay.

    The record and the facts speak for themselves.

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  11. To Anon@10:27AM
    The organization that provides the statistics used in that blog piece is closely aligned with the "French is in Danger" movement. In fact, that is the 'raison d'etre' for the existence of the IRFA.

    It has a close relationship to the OQLF-
    http://irfa.ca/n/nouvelle/marc-termote-membre-du-comite-scientifique-de-l-irfa-est-nomme-president-du-comite-de-suivi

    Readers should be aware of who prepared the studies.

    ReplyDelete
  12. You got to wonder why they want so badly your name. Since it is known that they use terror tactics on anyone who oppose them, even more so if you are allophone or anglophone, i respect your right to be anonymous. the name should matter in expressing opinions or facts.
    As for over financing:

    "Par sur-financement, ont veut dire le montant alloué en proportion du nombre d'étudiants inscrits"

    followed by

    "Il y a manifestement de la mauvaise foi, répétons: les anglos-québécois sont à peine 9% à 10% de la population."

    That has to be the stupidest oxymoronic factually incorrect statement i have seen here.
    So which is it too much money because of general population? or too much money per number of registerred students? as our editor demonstrated, more anglo and allophone go to university, requiring more funding than the % of the anglo population ratio. Add to this students from out of province and you get the idea. Logic is not the forte of the french militants. i just wished they would not be getting so much traction in the french media, and it would be nice for once someone demolished their sophistry.

    ReplyDelete
  13. I have received threats from extremists Yvan Major and cyber bully Louis Préfontaine, both were sent to the authorities who are still 'validating' these threats (which are empty although violent, so much so even my Francophone mates attack him right back):
    http://www.sqlservercentral.com/blogs/hugo/archive/2010/07/19/how-to-deal-with-quebec-s-extremists-expose-their-malfeasance-publically.aspx

    Another anecdote of bullying at a much bigger scale, that is responsible for much of QC's loss of retirement monies: http://www.sqlservercentral.com/blogs/hugo/archive/2010/02/15/first-public-hearing-against-quebec-s-pension-fund-manager-the-beginning-of-proof-multiple-laws-were-violated-before-sabia-took-over.aspx

    ReplyDelete
  14. @Miss sissau gals

    Pourquoi plusieurs pays de l'union Européenne (dont la Grèce et l'Espagne) et les É.U sont-ils en faillite ?Et le Japon ne l'est-il pas techniquement aussi ?Pourquoi le commerce du libre-échange des Amériques se fai-il exclusivement en Français-Anglais-Espagnole?

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  15. To Mississauga: Maybe you should open the dictionary, Hillbilly is an expression coming from US http://www.thefreedictionary.com/hillbilly. Ce n'est certainement pas une référence ni québécoise, ni française, désolé ! Vous avez l'air d'un péquenaud à ce compte ! Je ne savais pas qu'en Europe, les jeunes britanniques suivaient leur cursus en ourdou, vu l'importante communauté pakistanaise ? En France, les jeunes français suivent leurs cours en arabe (non-classique) car une portion importante de la population vient du Maghreb ? Et pourquoi pas le turc pour les allemands car la Turquie représente un pays de plus de 71 millions d'individus et qu'un forte communauté habite en Allemagne ? Vos arguments de liberté de choix, c'est n'importe quoi et ça ne tient pas la route !

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  16. Paris Guy said...

    Have you ever been to Brazil ? The english is not really spokent there ! In Italy too, if you don't have to speak it ? What's the obligation of learn it ? Je ne crois pas que l'apprentissage d'une langue se substitue à l'intelligence et l'éducation. À ce titre, le président russe ne parle pas anglais, il amène son interprète, quel est le problème ? On veut éliminer le métier d'interprète ? La compétence prime sur la connaissance d'une autre langue ! Plus on parle de langue, mieux c'est. Par contre, il existe plein de plouc qui parlent également anglais et qui franchement ne marqueront pas l'Histoire de leur empreinte... Donc, il faut relativiser les choses. Parler anglais c'est UTILE, point à la ligne. Ce n'est pas garant de rien. Pour preuve, allez faire un tour dans le ''deep deep Canada'', ça ressemble à ce que Mississauga Guy décrit mais en anglais ! Que dire des Hooligans et autres Jackass ? Ici, en France, pour avoir un poste dans l'import-export, l'anglais est utile mais l'espagnol, le mandarin et plusieurs autres langues.

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  17. @Mississauga Guy

    Insinuez-vous que la Floride,le Texas ainsi que les États voisins offrent une éducation gratuite en Espagnole ?Est-ce qu'un rattlesnake vénimeux vous aurait mordu par hasard?

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  18. This comment has been removed by the author.

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  19. @Dartgnan,

    @"Paris Guy"

    Paris Guy? Nice try there, Dartgnan.

    But to address your (irrelevant) examples, Quebec is not in the same situation as Italy or Brazil. Quebec is surrounded by the same language on all sides, and demographically outnumbered 100:1. And even inside Quebec, there are historical English-speaking communities, unlike in Italy and Brazil. Not to mention that Quebec isn’t even an officially recognized state. It’s merely a province within another country.

    So don’t compare apples and oranges.

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  20. Mississauga Guy clarified...

    I won't get into semantics re hillbillies. I'm trying to paint a picture, set a scene and I used hillbillies for a comparison. Choose your own terms for hicks, bumpkins and other terms to define rural ignoramuses.

    Too, nobody is saying Francophones have to learn English, but if you're in business and you want to sell into a market in excess of over 800 million people as opposed to less than ten million, then remain unilingually French. If you don't want to have more and better access to better job opportunities, then remain unilingually French.

    Look, I live here in Mississauga and I work in a phone center with unilingual English speaking teams and bilingual teams. Getting good bilingual people is far more difficult than unilingual candidates, so if there is ever a layoff, who's jobs do you think will be spared the cutbacks first?

    Bilingual teams can serve anybody across Canada, unilinguals cannot. It simply makes good business sense to serve as large a market as you can. More customers, more business, more profits. If you're the litte dépanneur, câsse-crout, gas station or barber serving a small community within a few kilometers of your store, unilingualism will suffice, and that's OK if you want to stay small. But if you want to serve beyond the Ottawa River cross over the southern tip of Lake Memphremagog and that friendly border at Beebe Plain and Rock Island, you know what you have to do!

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  21. "Hillbilly" may be a term that originated in the United States, but it is still a valid description for many rural Quebecois.

    I even heard a Francophone in a small Quebec town refer to the inhabitants of a nearby, smaller Quebecois town as hillbillies who were mostly living on welfare.

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  22. @Adski le parano

    Je vous le répète pour une dernière fois : Dartagnan n'existe plus sur ce blogue.Je suis Québécois et non Parisien.Tabarnak!Pourquoi je posterais sur 3 noms différents,quel est l'intérêt?Je suis Anonyme point a la ligne!

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  23. Ok, other's like Québécois learn english. What other language anglophones learn ? Especially when they live on a territory when the great majority speak an other language ? Les anglophones doivent s'intégrer à leur communauté ''d'accueil'' et non l'inverse. Si vous voulez parler d'opportunité économique, c'est autre chose. Mais commencez par quitter vos sphères de confort, c'est-à-dire vos référents anglo-saxons et après vous pourrez donner des leçons sur comment les autres doivent être avec vous !

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  24. Paris Guy said... Pas besoin d'un cours sur l'utilité de connaître plusieurs langues. Les anglos pures-laines d'Amérique du Nord parlent quelle autre langue en général ? Il y en a une méchante bande qui ne parle qu'anglais, est-ce que cela en fait des Hillbillies ? Le multilinguisme chez les autres mais nous (anglophones) n'avons pas à apprendre d'autres langues ! Tout une façon de penser l'ouverture d'esprit ! « Ceux qui, sous prétexte d’une certaine fatigue constitutionnelle, souhaitent que Québec se tienne coi font preuve d’inconscience ou, pire, de complicité avec le gouvernement fédéral contre les intérêts du Québec. Leur position équivaut à vouloir imposer une trêve qui ne s’appliquerait qu’à l’un des camps en présence. Or, comme on peut le voir depuis plusieurs mois, le Canada et son équipe n’entendent pas pour leur part se mettre au neutre. » — Bernard Descôteaux

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  25. "...define rural ignoramuses"

    Existent-ils dans les "eastern townships" plus précisément a Lennoxville ou se trouvent vos origines? Remarquez que mississauga n'est guère mieux car on y retrouve beaucoup de culs terreux qui rêvent de faire fortune a Toronto.

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  26. To address the above post...

    Anglos are Quebecers too. You make it seem like they're a completely different ethnicity by making claims like "Les anglophones doivent s'intégrer à leur communauté ''d'accueil'' et non l'inverse."
    This is typical Quebecois racism at its best. Francophones, for some reason, believe that the Anglo minority owe them respect. Ok, firstly you have to earn your respect and secondly, we don't owe you any respect whatsoever. If anything it's the other way around because it was our policy that allowed your culture to exist. Do you honestly believe that the French Canadian culture would currently exist had the British Parliament followed Lord Durham's advice? I think not!

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  27. Anonymous 1.51PM
    Salut Louis, je vois que tu demeure aveugle a ton manque de connaissance du monde, car tu évite toujours la question en repointant vers le messager son manque de connaissance du français, au moins il sait plus de ce qui l'entoure que toi. Anglophobe et moulin a vents que tu est, ignare et ignoble bravo.
    Au lieu d'ancrer Montréal comme un pôle d’attraction de l’Amérique du nord, bilingue et dynamique, capable de gérer les entreprises du continents, ont obtient le Montréal modèle village, ou la gestion de ces entreprises ce fait a l’extérieur. Villageois réjouissez vous on vous amenuise :)
    30 ans d'idiotie, nous place au dernier rang de l'Amériques du nord, bravo louis, lâche pas. Votes PQ, j'ai un garagae un gros garage.
    /sarcasm off

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  28. To address the above post: Go see in other provinces how francophones are treated- like completely different ethnicity. Il n'est pas question de devoir respect--mais plus simplement de ne pas avoir des comportements impérialistes comme: ''I don't speak french ! You speak english ?'' Si après des années de vie au Québec, vous n'avez jamais appris le français, il y a un sérieux problème... Soit vous ne quittez pas Senneville, soit vous faites en sorte que tous les francophones vous parle anglais... C'est le deuxième cas qui pose un problème ! Et finalement, vous devriez réviser vos manuels d'histoire, la pérennité de la culture québécoise, acadienne et canadienne française n'est pas due aux bonnes pensées et pratiques du Parlement britannique qui n'a pas mis à exécution le Rapport Durham. C'est plutôt dû à une volonté de survivre collectivement (culturellement) et à une politique nataliste mise de l'avant par le clergé catholique.

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  29. Pourquoi ne pas ancrer Ottawa pôle d’attraction de l’Amérique du nord, bilingue et dynamique, capable de gérer les entreprises du continents ? N'est-ce pas la capitale ''bilingue'' d'un pays ''bilingue''?

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  30. Ottawa got bypassed, Toronto swallowed our position whole, none of their doing, ours only in quebec. We went in the last 30 years, from frist financial and economic center in the country, to 2nd, then 3rd and now we stand 4th and still falling. Impressive no? the nationalist zealots the world over allways have the same recipe of disaster, and they allways find sheeps with a chip on their shoulder bent on revenge willing to destroy it. Bravo Louis!

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  31. Anonymous said...@September 7, 2010 4:54 PM

    "Pourquoi ne pas ancrer Ottawa pôle
    d’attraction de l’Amérique du nord,blah...blah?"

    Are you really that slow? Been to the "port"
    of Ottawa? Montreal was Canada's economic
    engine and a major port in North America
    until brain dead separtist policies drove
    business away.

    To the poster above you:

    How well any Candian living in Quebec
    speaks French is NONE OF YOUR FUCKING BUSINESS!

    Secondly, you really want to thank the church
    for what they did to French Canadians in the
    past? Like it or not, you owe your cultures'
    very existence to the country you have so
    little respect for. Truly pathetic.

    ReplyDelete
  32. "Anglos are Quebecers too..."

    Non,vous êtes des canadians car vous pensez et parlez comme des canadians.Être Québécois c'est beaucoup plus que d'être résident du Québec.

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  33. " Il n'est pas question de devoir respect--mais plus simplement de ne pas avoir des comportements impérialistes comme: ''I don't speak french ! You speak english ?'' Si après des années de vie au Québec, vous n'avez jamais appris le français, il y a un sérieux problème."
    So if a tourist asks to be spoken in English, that makes the person an imperialist? Are you that fuckin stupid? And secondly, whether I choose to speak English or French in Quebec is my business. If you live in N.America and don't speak English, as the French say "c'est grave ca"

    "To address the above post: Go see in other provinces how francophones are treated- like completely different ethnicity."
    They're treated like Canadians. As a matter of fact, Francophones make up 62% of all bilingual federal positions in govt.
    http://www.psc-cfp.gc.ca/arp-rpa/2009/st-ts/tbl07/tbl16-eng.htm
    Don't you fuckin dare say that Francophones are treated like garbage across Canada.

    "Non,vous êtes des canadians car vous pensez et parlez comme des canadians.Être Québécois c'est beaucoup plus que d'être résident du Québec"
    Wrong. French Canadians residing in Quebec are Canadians whether you like it or not.

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  34. "Non,vous êtes des canadians car vous pensez et parlez comme des canadians.Être Québécois c'est beaucoup plus que d'être résident du Québec."

    Unfortunately, this only shows how shallow your knowledge is. Below is straight from Le grand dictionnaire de L'Office québécois de la langue francais. I would love to see you saying that the definition is wrong.

    >>>>>
    Québécois n. m.

    Équivalent(s)
    English Québécois


    Définition :
    Personne qui habite au Québec.

    Sous-entrée(s) :

    forme(s) féminine(s)
    Québécoise n. f.

    Note(s) :
    C'est à partir des années 1960 que Québécois fut employé pour désigner les habitants de la province de Québec. Québécois a d'abord été employé pour désigner les habitants de la ville de Québec, attesté pour la première fois dans ce sens en 1754 (on le trouvait alors aussi orthographié Québecquois).


    Le terme Québécois et ses équivalents anglais peuvent également être adjectifs. En français, les adjectifs correspondant aux noms d'habitants s'écrivent toujours avec une minuscule initiale, contrairement aux noms propres qui débutent par une majuscule. Par exemple, on écrira : un Québécois, mais la culture québécoise.
    <<<<<

    http://www.granddictionnaire.com/BTML/FRA/r_Motclef/index800_1.asp

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  35. Les Anglais vivant au Canada ne changeront vraiment pas, ces voleurs d'identité. Originellement, les Canadiens étaient ceux qui parlaient français. En 1867, ceux qui parlaient anglais se sont approprié le terme Canadien. Les autres sont devenus Canadiens français.

    En 1880, le 24 juin, les Canadiens "français" se sont donné un hymne national : Ô Canada. En 1980, les Canadiens-anglais se le sont approprié (heureusement, nous en aurons bientôt un autre : Gens du pays). Ajoutons à cela qu'ils se sont approprié le Club de hockey Canadien.

    Maintenant, il y en a qui veulent s'approprier le terme Québécois ?! Ça va faire tabarnak ! Quand on vous dit de sacrer vot camp, pis que vous êtes pas chez vous, c'est pas pour rien, crisses de blokes !

    Vous ne vous rendez pas compte, petit peuple, que vous portez un nom qui n'est pas à vous, que vous chantez un hymne national qui n'est pas à vous et que vous consommez une culture de masse qui n'est pas à vous !!! Mais qu'apportez-vous donc au monde ? Qu'apportez-vous à la diversité culturelle du monde ? Race de sangsues !!!

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  36. "Vous ne vous rendez pas compte, petit peuple, que vous portez un nom qui n'est pas à vous, que vous chantez un hymne national qui n'est pas à vous et que vous consommez une culture de masse qui n'est pas à vous !!! Mais qu'apportez-vous donc au monde ? Qu'apportez-vous à la diversité culturelle du monde ? Race de sangsues !!!"

    Wow what a retard, do you realize that in 1795 95% of the population of montreal was english, that the scotish immigrant that came here built it's economic power, under the french regime the governor was giving monopolistic licenses, in example you would pay to get the right to be the lone canoe builder. Ask La Verandry what he thought of the governor of Quebec. You are such a racist it's not even funny.

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  37. "...and demographically outnumbered 100:1. And even inside Quebec, there are historical English-speaking communities, unlike in..."

    En voila de bonnes raisons pour protèger notre langue ainsi que notre culture.Même si vous vous contredisez continuellement,nous vous remercions M.Adski pour ces chiffres forts révélateurs.Moi qui croyait que vous étiez un fédé sans scrupule.

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  38. Wait a moment here.

    Anonymous at 19:40 said that Anglophones are not Québécois and I just proved him wrong. If I am wrong, show me where I am wrong. Show me the definition of "Québécois". I would say that the OQLF is the authoritative body in the French language in Quebec. Do you not agree?

    If you disagree with me, show me the proof. Show me the authoritative definition of "Québécois". Of course something is not necessary right just because you say so. Who are you that you think you represents majority of Quebecers? Who are you to think that you have the authority to define the term? And who are you to say that I, Adski, the Editor and other Anglophones who live in Quebec are not Quebecers?

    Another thing, if the national anthem actually belongs to Quebec, why from the beginning of it composing it is named "Ô Canada" instead of "Ô Québec?"

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  39. "Non,vous êtes des canadians car vous pensez et parlez comme des canadians.Être Québécois c'est beaucoup plus que d'être résident du Québec."

    Eh ben. Alors, si je suis Québécoise de souche mais que je ne partage pas du tout les idées des militants francophones freaks à la Louis Préfontaine, je ne suis pas une vraie Québécoise? Oh. Je dois être une Canadienne-Française. OH MAIS C'EST VRAI! Le Québec n'est pas un pays après tout...

    Ridicule.

    Allez dire ça aussi à tous ses fils et filles d'immigrants ou même ces immigrants reçus, ayant leur citoyenneté et vivant au Québec qu'ils ne sont pas Québécois...

    Quelle belle démonstration de fermeture d'esprit.

    -Geneviève

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  40. @Troy

    Les Québécois sont et forment officiellement une nation dont la langue officielle est le Français.

    Êtes-vous toujours nationaliste Troy?

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  41. @Geneviève

    Tiens,une femelle ici...vous êtes égarée?

    Faudrait d'abord que vous leur demandiez si ils se sentent Québécois et pour quelles raisons.
    Aux dernières nouvelles,ça semblait plutôt négatif.

    BiBi

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  42. "Définition :
    Personne qui habite au Québec."

    Une définition plus juste serait plutôt:
    Personne qui est habitée par le Québec.

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  43. créez-la, la citoyenneté québécoise. Nous l'aurons tous, qu'on soit séparatistes ou fédéralistes.

    ... à moins que vous vouliez nous restreindre/dépourvoir de notre citoyenneté... tout comme les nazis ont fait à leurs propres compatriotes "indésirables" lors de l'adoption des lois de Nuremberg.

    Est-ce qu'on est vraiment rendus au point où vous êtes prêts à nous exclure de la société la moitié de nous québécois pour le seul motif de ne pas partager votre maladive pureté de sang politique?

    ... ou est-ce que vous nous réservez un sort plus macabre?

    chapeau @ ma compatriote Geneviève.

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  44. Anonymous at 2010.09.07 21:22 said...

    >>>>>
    @Troy

    Les Québécois sont et forment officiellement une nation dont la langue officielle est le Français.

    Êtes-vous toujours nationaliste Troy?
    <<<<<

    And whose definition is that? Yours? How did you get into that definition? Out of thin air?

    Can you give me a definition from an authoritative and legitimate body? The government or the National Assembly, perhaps?

    As for your last sentence, please let me know if you have a difficulty in comprehending my posts.

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  45. @Apparatchik

    I actually think that Quebec citizenship would be a failure, because many people would refuse it. Allophones and Anglophones for sure, and many Francophones too. With a Canadian passport in your pocket, what do you need another citizenship for? Especially a parochial citizenship like the Quebec one?

    This makes me think that if Quebec citizenship ever came into existence, it would be one of those things that is very easily granted but not as easily rescinded. I think that to avoid humiliation and embarrassment, Quebec government would do everything in its power to ensure that all residents of QC (8 million people) become Quebec citizens. On voluntary “we give it to those that want it” basis, they wouldn’t garner more than 3 million people.

    Personally, I would never accept Quebecois citizenship, even if it meant losing voting rights within administrative borders of Quebec. Because I don’t really exercise this right in provincial elections anyways (there is nothing that represents me here), and on rare occasions that I do, it’s to vote for the proverbial “lesser evil” (the PLQ), and not for someone I can really relate to. Secondly, being a Quebec citizen would make me feel hypocritical due to my general opinion of this province. Yes, I’d rather live in Quebec as an expat than a full fledged citizen. It would be much easier to bear psychologically.

    If, however, Quebec government decided to grant its citizenship widescale and indiscriminately to all those who lived here for a long time and can function in French, I would do everything in my power to renounce it. And I’d be willing to pay all the legal fees required, if necessary.

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  46. Paris Guy said: To Steve:September 7, 2010 7:04 PM - Si ce que j'ai écris " Il n'est pas question de devoir respect--mais plus simplement de ne pas avoir des comportements impérialistes comme: ''I don't speak french ! You speak english ?'' Si après des années de vie au Québec, vous n'avez jamais appris le français, il y a un sérieux problème." s'appliquait aux touristes, vous êtes vraiment plus niais qu'il n'en faut. Vous savez très bien de quoi il s'agit: De ces individus qui ont passés leur vie au Québec, à travailler avec des francophones mais qui n'ont jamais fait le moindre effort d'intégration et d'apprentissage du français. Les touristes, ont les aborde en français au départ, s'ils ne comprennent pas, on change de langue mais il faut briser le réflexe idiot de présager qu'un étranger parle automatiquement anglais (ce qui est faux dans les faits). J'ai longtemps travaillé dans l'industrie touristique à Montréal, j'ai toujours répondu aux gens en français en premier. S'il ne comprenait pas, je changeais pour l'anglais ou l'espagnol (je perfectionnerai ces deux langues secondes et peut-être me risquerais-je à une autre comme le mandarin ou l'arabe, qui sait...). Par contre, je me suis rendu compte que bien des anglophones de façade parlaient français mais ne se forçait tout simplement pas ! Je parlais donc français et eux me répondaient en anglais, dans ce cas-ci, pas de problème... Voilà une façon arrogante et impérialiste d'agir, pas seulement ici mais ailleurs. Comment expliquer qu'un anglophone puisse voyager en Amérique latine durant plus de 3 mois en ne rapportant comme bagage linguistique que ''uno,dos,cerveza et gracias'', il tente d'imposer l'anglais là-bas. Le problème c'est que ce touriste est en voyage ailleurs, ce n'est pas à ''l'ailleurs'' à apprendre la langue du touriste mais bien au touriste à apprendre celle du pays. Lorsque je vais au États-Unis ou au Canada anglais, personne ne se fait un devoir de me servir en français, c'est quoi ces folies là, apprenez le français si vous résidez au Québec comme résident ou citoyen, point final.

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  47. "Because I don’t really exercise this right in provincial elections anyways (there is nothing that represents me here)"

    @Madski

    Récapitulons: Vous n'aimez pas le Français,Vous n'aimez pas notre culture,Vous n'aimez pas nos politiciens,vous n'aimez pas nos politiques,vous n'aimez pas notre accent ni notre système d'éducation ,vous n'aimez pas la poutine,etc.

    Veux-tu bien me dire qu'est-ce tu calisses au Québec ? A part chiâler bien entendu.

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  48. "As for your last sentence, please let me know if you have a difficulty in comprehending my posts."

    Pas du tout Troy "r" us , en bref,vous ne voulez pas être Québécois et ça vous regarde.

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  49. Wow, BiBi, tu es en manque d'arguments à ce point-là pour tenter de m'insulter parce que je suis "femelle"?

    Ça fait pitié ton affaire.

    -Geneviève

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  50. "Pas du tout Troy "r" us , en bref,vous ne voulez pas être Québécois et ça vous regarde."
    If he lives in Quebec, he's a Quebecer. End of fucking story.

    "Par contre, je me suis rendu compte que bien des anglophones de façade parlaient français mais ne se forçait tout simplement pas ! Je parlais donc français et eux me répondaient en anglais, dans ce cas-ci, pas de problème... Voilà une façon arrogante et impérialiste d'agir, pas seulement ici mais ailleurs."
    Some people have a harder time speaking a language then hearing it. This doesn't make them imperialists.

    "Lorsque je vais au États-Unis ou au Canada anglais, personne ne se fait un devoir de me servir en français, c'est quoi ces folies là, apprenez le français si vous résidez au Québec comme résident ou citoyen, point final"
    If I learn French, it will be on own free will, not because some French language bigot forces me to. As an English speaking Quebecer *gasp* I have the right to be served in English just as Francophones have the right to be served in French in the other provinces. Having said this, most Anglophones make an effort to learn French and integrate into Quebec's Francophones society, despite what the language bigots have been telling you for all these years. It is in their best interest to learn French, since bilingual people earn more statistically speaking. If I choose to live in Quebec, it will be my own personal choice to learn French, whether you like it or not.

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  51. "If he lives in Quebec, he's a Quebecer. End of fucking story."

    Donc si je veux devenir Chinois,je n'ai qu'a aller habiter en Chine?Wow!

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  52. "I have the right to be served in English just as Francophones have the right to be served in French in the other provinces."

    J'ai traversé le Canada a 2 reprises et j'ai du mal a croire que c'est un pays avec 2 langues officielles.Il est plus simple de dire "a coffee please" ça évite certains problêmes.Pourtant le mot café ressemble étrangement a coffee n'est-ce pas? L'érudition des serveuses anglos de Tim Horton m'impressionne toujours.Un dounotte avec ça?

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  53. "Donc si je veux devenir Chinois,je n'ai qu'a aller habiter en Chine?Wow!"
    If your family has lived in China for many centuries, created communities etc.., then yes, you are Chinese. The Anglo-Quebecers have been living in Quebec for generations, going back to the 18th cent. You have no right telling us we're not Quebecers when we've been here just as long as you have.

    "J'ai traversé le Canada a 2 reprises et j'ai du mal a croire que c'est un pays avec 2 langues officielles.Il est plus simple de dire "a coffee please" ça évite certains problêmes"
    WEll, duh. The majority is English speaking. No Anglo in Quebec is demanding that they get served in English FIRST. All I said is that we have a right to be served in our language. And for your info, there are French schools and hospitals in all other provinces.

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  54. Paris Guy sais: ''Lorsque je vais au États-Unis ou au Canada anglais, personne ne se fait un devoir de me servir en français, c'est quoi ces folies là, apprenez le français si vous résidez au Québec comme résident ou citoyen, point final.'' Avec vos droits par-ci, vos droits par-là ! Et le droit des autres ?

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  55. La majorité des défenseurs du français mente. Il est clair qu'il semble avoir comme priorité la haine de l'anglais bien avant la défense du français. Ce n'est qu'un leurre.

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  56. Amazing how the Quebec based French supremacists can't wrap their tiny little brains around a few basic realities, namely that:

    a) Quebec is NOT a French state, nor has it ever been a French state. Moreover, even when the French language was at its most dominant, after the French crown ruthlessly conquered the natives, the area permantly settled by French speakers was miniscule compared to the Province that was created over time by the British Crown. The bottom line is that English has been a public language of Quebec for centuries.

    b) As a corollary to the first point, this ridiculous notion of Anglophones "integrating" into "Quebec society" is false, assinine and insulting to anyone who prefers to operate in English in Quebec. English-speaking Quebecers are as equally valid a visage of Quebec as their French-speaking counterparts. Montreal was for a not insignificant part of the nineteenth century, a majority English-speaking city. Members of the Anglophone community, whether or not they eat poutine/pudding chomeur/pigs feet/tortiere/ragout de boulettes, speak a word of French, support the oilsands or root for the Maple Leafs, are JUST AS VALIDLY Quebecers are every single French-Canadian de pur laine.

    c) English is the international language of commerce, science, popular culture and politics, and you continue to dwell in your box of ignorance at your own peril. See how the Netherlands, or the Nordic countries have dealt with this reality and you'll understand why Quebec is rapidly devolving into a third-world cesspit where nobody wishes to invest, and where very few quality immigrants wish to migrate to.

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